Beginner - going through white water

[chrisdot]

Hi guys, I'm new to this forum. I'm 27 male, 5"10, 185lbs riding on Wavestorm 8"0', living in San Diego. I had one surfing lesson, then I spent overall about 30 hours in water. I can surf in white water already.
My problem is that I'm having a lot of troubles trying to go through that white water to the regular wave. As far as I know there are three ways of doing it:
- turtle roll
- sit on the back of the board facing the wave, once white water hits then jump forward with the board
- paddle, then when white water hits push the nose under water, and stretch upper body up

Turtle roll - for me it makes sense to do it to go under regular, bigger wave. In my case turtle roll takes a lot of time and I can do only about 3-4 of them in row. If more needed, I give up, I'm tired.
Sit on the back - that kind of works, I'm not getting smashed. However every 'sit back' I go backwards a little bit. Then paddling and 'sit back' again. I end up going back and forth and not moving forward at all eventually.
Pushing the board under white water - that's the worst I think. In my case board goes under wave, that's fine. But then white water just grabs my hands, and my chest and moves backwards quite long way.

I made it few times through white water to the regular wave. Mostly on Pacific Beach - shallow water that lets me walk quite far. Then I would fight white water by jumping and then feet against the bottom. Once it gets a bit calmer, quick jump on the board, paddle hard, one or two turtle rolls and it happened.
Every time I succeeded, however, I was really wasted. I had to wait 5min before trying to ride a wave. My paddling probably sucks. I can swim around 300meters freestyle stroke with long breaks on the swimming pool, and I'm done.
What do you think I should focus on? I can do some work-outs on the gym, I can do some swimming pool time, I can try to master turtle rolls, whatever will let me enjoy surfing more. Maybe I should get more lessons? Maybe new board? I saw plenty of people though surfing really well on Wavestorm, e.g. this guy

Cheers,
Chris

[waikikikichan]

Then I would fight white water by jumping and then feet against the bottom. Once it gets a bit calmer, quick jump on the board, paddle hard, one or two turtle rolls and it happened.
Every time I succeeded, however, I was really wasted. I had to wait 5min before trying to ride a wave.

Sounds fine to me. You're doing what you need to do. If you got to wait even 10 minutes to recover, so be it. Take that time to scan the break, where is best to line up, who is catching the waves, which way they go, etc. A bad thing is to turn around immediately and catch the first wave that comes through.

[dtc]

Well, firstly you are a bit unfit. You should be able to swim at least 500m without stopping in a pool. So work on that (I mean, unfit swimming wise - swimming is so unnatural that you don't get fit unless you actually do it-no one gets swim fit walking or running. You may otherwise be quite fit). What happens if the leg rope breaks, how will you swim back in?

Swimming doesn't directly translate to paddling, but it's the closest thing other than actually paddling. Just work on it - 100m non stop then 200m etc.

Secondly white water can be hard to get through, but the fitter the better. See if you can find a spot where the waves aren't breaking (usually a rip) and paddle out there, even if it means you paddle out and then have to paddle sideways to get to the right spot. Sometimes it's just exhausting, no question. Paddle out and rest, it's OK to do that. Everyone does, they might just hide it better

Your techniques seem fine, there is no magic secret you don't know; just need to practice of course, as with every new skill.

As to gym, when you paddle note which bits of you hurt. Triceps or shoulders probably, work on them.

Finally, check your paddling technique. Pull using your lats (think of pulling your elbows back rather than hands). Don't go too wide, pull hands down close to the board. There are videos to give you some tips

You aren't the first learner to discover these problems; you can't get fit that quickly and it's tiring. It gets better

[jaffa1949]

Simple rule of thumb, if you can't get out through the white water you are not ready for green rides!
It is a matter of degrees, small waves small white water and so on up!

There is white water big enough out there to limit anyone, Waimea shore break stops me every time!

[Big H]

Simple rule of thumb, if you can't get out through the white water you are not ready for green rides!
It is a matter of degrees, small waves small white water and so on up!

There is white water big enough out there to limit anyone, Waimea shore break stops me every time!

Honestly as simple as it sounds, that is the answer....do like DTC said, be clever, look for channels, lulls in the sets, softest part of the breaking wave that you could just power through....but all that takes time in the water....you'll get stronger, fitter, more adept at turning turtle, better and faster at paddling and better at reading the break....all those things will eventually add up to begin able to get out back on a regular basis.....

....there are days that I go to my local (or don't go as the case may be) because with certain conditions it is da@#$mn near impossible to get out back and once you're there your choice is to ride a right or left towering closeout.....point of that story is that maybe it's the wrong beach, or if no one is in the water (like today....absolutely horrible conditions with sustained 30+kph onshore winds and a hard driving rain) it might be the wrong time to go surfing....

Last bit of advice....how do other people get out back? If they can do it on a similar sized board, watch and see how they arrange it....do they wait for timing between sets? Do they all paddle out in the same area? What is their technique for coping with the waves and whitewater? If they just paddle straight up the gut, turtle when they have to and push through otherwise then you have the simple answer that it is just that your paddling is weak and your turtle rolls are slow and clumsy, and you need to work on your push through technique....and then you know what to "work on" besides riding whitewater when you are in the water.

[RinkyDink]

What do you think I should focus on? I can do some work-outs on the gym, I can do some swimming pool time, I can try to master turtle rolls, whatever will let me enjoy surfing more. Maybe I should get more lessons? Maybe new board?

Don't work out in a gym unless you can't get to a beach. You're better off working out in the actual ocean.

You could do push-ups in a gym, but why would you do that when you can do popup after popup in whitewater?
You could do squats in a gym, but why would you do that when you can do popup after popup in whitewater?
You could do lunges in a gym, but why would you do that when you can do popup after popup in whitewater?
You could work on your cardio in a gym, but why would you do that when you could practice paddling outside, taking a short breather, taking off on a wave, practice paddling outside again, rinse and repeat until you're physically spent?

The beach is an amazing place to get fit. And best of all it's free.

[BoMan]

maybe it's the wrong beach, or if no one is in the water (like today....absolutely horrible conditions with sustained 30+kph onshore winds and a hard driving rain) it might be the wrong time to go surfing.

I agree with every post and suggest that you also look at online surf reports for your favorite spot. Magic Seaweed is very accurate for my break and can help you choose days and times to have the most success! Here is a link for the Pacific Beach report.

http://magicseaweed.com/Pacific-Beach-Surf-Report/663/

[oldmansurfer]

I think you should shoot for being able to swim 1000 meters without stopping and also train swimming fast for one lap too. So I would swim for distance first then rest and do sprints. Surfing is so complex because there are so many ancillary skills. One of the things you should do before you go out is to observe the surf. Look at where the waves are breaking and where they aren't, look for currents and rocks and shallow areas. Think about what would be the easiest way out and also to come back in also where you don't want to be paddling out or coming in. Watch what the other surfers do. Fitness is the key however a little analysis will help you out too as will earning the skills to go through the surf. All of the techniques you mentioned are useful in paddling out but you need to learn how to do them better and in what instances to do what technique. Having a friend accompany you out can be helpful in learning when to do what. If they are right beside you doing the same technique and it works for them and not for you then you can see it is because you don't know how to do it. If they do some other technique then you would know you are doing the wrong one for that situation.

[oldmansurfer]

What I mean by training one fast lap is to swim one lap as fast as you can then rest then swim another as fast as you can then rest and repeat.

[chrisdot]

Wow, many people here. I didn't expect to receive a single answer.
For the swimming part on its own - I can swim breaststroke for a long time. I used to do freediving when I was younger. As a kid I did entry lifeguard license, sounds unbelievable, doesn't it? That's why I'm in general fine being wiped out, or losing the board. I will manage to go back on my own if needed.
Freestyle stroke, however, is totally different story. As I said - when I go to swimming pool I would do around 12x25m with some rest between laps and I'm wasted. The same applies for paddling - I actually started counting my paddle moves to get some more motivation. If 40 paddle-moves on the surfboard don't get me back there, I usually give up and surf on my belly with white water. That's why the only time I managed to get back there - I used the sea bottom to walk as far as possible.

Regarding the size of the wave. I tried initially small waves, around knee to waist. They were easier to go through, but then I couldn't take off - maybe because of paddling again? Taking off in white water is easy, because paddling is not necessary. Taking off on a regular, but small wave is way harder for me. Wave most of the time would just go under my board.
Then I tried higher waves, around chest to head. First try - I dropped square down from the wave and got my beating. Next try I broke the board :\. At least I was closer to taking off.

Pacific Beach has no rocks, there is only sand on the bottom. Bottom is very flat and predictable. Waves, when they approach, they are very wide. I didn't find any better/worse spots, I didn't find riptides. I have a feeling that every wave causes riptide in different place. No obviously better spots. Maybe except one place, just for me, where the bottom is little bit shallower and I can walk further.

I live 40min drive from the beach, usually surf only on weekends. It gets dark very early here in San Diego, so evenings are bad idea in general. I could do mornings during the week, but that would mean getting up really early which I'm not used to. Although my work schedule is very flexible.

I usually go to gym 2-4 times a week. I can run 2 miles in 13:30, I do bench-presses/deadlifts, pull-ups and other normal exercises, so some basic level of fitness is there, that's what I think. Surfing seems way more demanding than other sports, like skiing, snowboarding or windsurfing. I'm pretty lost and I have many doubts. Maybe I go to wrong beach? Maybe I have a wrong board? Maybe the weather on a given day is bad? Maybe I try to approach wrong waves? There is not much of a community of surfers in San Diego. There are plenty of people surfing, but not a community.

BoMan, thanks for the forecast. Looks like tomorrow 6AM Pacific Beach is going to have 5 stars, 4-6 feet. If I manage to get up early I might try it.
Then improving freestyle stroke on the swimming pool sounds like a good alternative for evenings.
oldmansurfer, can you really freestyle stroke for 1000m with no resting? I can do 50m with no resting, 100m and I would be just about to drown.

[oldmansurfer]

I haven't tried it lately but imagine a mile or so no problem. Back when I was in shape and on the swim team we warmed up with 80 laps (25 yard pool) then did sprints. I could swim multiple miles if needed back in those days. Honestly I haven't even tried just swimming but paddling a board I rarely get tired and have to rest. It happens from time to time when the waves are big and I get caught inside. I used to miss a lot of waves because I was tired after paddling out but lately not much. Being fit is really the key to enjoying surfing more. I can go out in much more different conditions and have more fun than others who aren't in as good shape as me and I am not in the best shape of my life. I have been out a few times last year with youngsters (guys in their 20's and 30's) and I am 62. I had fun and they were like "You couldn't pay me to go out in waves like that" and "I don't work that hard when I work". For me it was "I got a good workout and good working over and caught a nice wave or two" I am 62 years old. I quit the swim team when I was in the 9th grade in high school and after that I never swam in a pool or competitively. I body surfed and paipo boarded and after I graduated from school I started surfing. The coach of the high school I went to was one of the swimmers on the team back when I was on it and they knew I was still around so they asked me to be a timer at one of the races and told me to bring my shorts because all the timers were ex-swimmers and they were going to have us race after it was over to kill time while they got ready for the awards. I not only won but did it in better time than the swimmers. I think swimming is a good exercise for surfing and vice versa but only if you paddle a lot. One little detail I didn't tell you is back in those days you had to be a good swimmer to be a good surfer because there were no leashes and you had to swim for your board frequently. But still I am certain I can swim a mile no problem and 1km even easier. With skiing, snowboarding, windsurfing, you don't have to paddle through the waves to get going or paddle to catch a wave. I knew an Olympic skier who wanted to learn how to surf and it was very difficult for him especially since he didn't know the ocean that well. Oh well..... if it was so easy everyone would be surfing and then where would we go?

[chrisdot]

Haha, you are good guy oldmansurfer. I guess you just have good genes to begin with. I will introduce some quality laps on the swimming pool after work. As I said - evenings here are a no go for surfing anyway.

[RinkyDink]

if it was so easy everyone would be surfing and then where would we go?

When bionic arms are invented five years from now, we won't have any place to go

[jaffa1949]

Wow it really is fitness that is letting you down, surfing is over 90% paddling riding the wave very little.
No other board sport requires you to paddle out and onto a wave, you just point yourself downhill and you are already standing and gravity sucks!
Surf more take your beatings and from your description learn the best on the board to paddle.
More lessons needed, BTW Wavestorms are very hard to duck dive, cork buoyancy.
Learn to read the beach, ask your surf instructor watch how others go out and spend time building paddle power by paddling.
Regular surfers are match fit by regular surfing as well as any other activity.

[RinkyDink]

With respect to getting into shape, I would add one other crucial element to getting your body into surfing condition. SLEEP. It's just as important as working out. Not only do you process and learn the things you practiced during your surfing session while you sleep, but your body builds muscle as well. Don't neglect rest and sleep. Just my two cents.

[chrisdot]

Just came back from the swimming pool. Did 130 laps of breaststroke and didn't even feel tired. They closed the pool, otherwise I could keep going for way longer. Now I have to say it's frustrating. I was always able to keep up with friends that were into something, like climbing, windsurfing, skiing, diving and others. Few hours of training and I was able to perform on a level that would let me participate and enjoy.
Surfing is totally unlike that.
Anyway, next time on the pool I will check how many freestyle stroke laps I can do. I'm expecting something between 2 and 4 .

[oldmansurfer]

It's good to know you can breaststroke. Long ago when I got separated from my board and was tired I would temporarily switch to breast stroke then back to freestyle. If you want to train for surfing then it's freestyle you want to do. You probably just need to work on your breathing. In breast stroke the breathing is easy and you can easily alter the stroke and keep your head above water all the time. You can actually do this with freestyle too but it's not quite as easy. When you are in the ocean you may need to alter your form to breath better but in a pool you don't.

[drowningbitbybit]

Did 130 laps of breaststroke and didn't even feel tired. ... next time on the pool I will check how many freestyle stroke laps I can do. I'm expecting something between 2 and 4 .

Sadly, breaststroke is about zero use when it comes to paddling!
Even freestyle is only limited use - the paddling action is totally different.

I find the best way to increase paddle fitness in a pool is to do front crawl, but arch your back and keep your head out of the water, as if you were on a surfboard. And only use your legs enough to keep your body from sinking - not for propulsion. It's a hopelessly inefficient way to swim, but really good exercise for paddling - and you'll only need to do one length to get out of breath so it doesn't get boring!

[jaffa1949]

Chrisdot, bite the bullet get serious about getting surf fit, go for paddles on flat days do reps and sprints and long reps and long sprints and swim without using your legs, forget breast stroke, swim, talk to a gym guy and see what reps he can design for you.
Go surfing as often as possible all the guys that can surf well have good basic surf fitness, pros do extra stuff to give them even more of an edge.
one extra benefit of all the fitness stuff you will need to do is your health improvement.
good food , yoga ,or pilates, no cigarettes .
lean mean surfing machine.
Unless you earn your place in the surf your are just another bobbing cork!

[dtc]

Swimming is like anything - if you don't push yourself, you aren't being efficient. Its like going to the gym and benching the bar. Sure you can do 30 reps, but does it get you anywhere? Swimming 130 laps of breaststroke at a slow pace is like benching the bar. Its an impressive distance but is only useful if you intend to compete in a long distance breaststroke race. Next time, do 50m free then 50m breaststroke (recovery lap - so no need to stop and rest) and repeat x 5. Then next session repeat x8 then x10. Then do 100m freestyle, 50m breaststroke - etc. Its like when you are starting off jogging - you jog, walk, jog. Over time you increase the jog part and decrease the walk. Once you can do, say, 500m or 800m free without stopping, then do as old man says and mix in some high intensity laps.

In terms of gym, I have spent a lot of time thinking about a good gym workout for surfing but haven't really come up with one. The trouble is, every time you think of a muscle, you can think of a way you use it when surfing. So its hard to be too specific. And what weight and reps? Power is useful for catching waves, and power can overcome positioning mistakes. But, at the end of the day, 10yr old girls can catch waves and (as the father of a 10yr old girl), they really aren't very powerful! So power is useful but not essential; but then again it is useful...

My conclusion is that a good surfing gym workout is an all body workout using on higher reps (10X) with a slightly greater focus on back and shoulders eg throw in some extra pull ups/chin ups, rows, some triceps and push ups (more than bench), any shoulder exercise (military press, lateral raise, delt flys). Rope climb or battle ropes are good as well. Continue to do the other major lifts, but swap a chest day for another back day, or a leg day for another back day. I couldn’t actually say that gym helps a huge amount with surfing - I have always been going to the gym and have nothing to compare it against - but there are plenty of surfers who don’t go to the gym at all and are much more surfing fit. However, surfing is not the only reason to go to the gym, and going to the gym is always worthwhile regardless.

At the end of the day, surf skills and understanding the ocean counts for much more.