Addicted to buoyancy

[spindlehead]

Hello all, this is my first post on Surfing Waves and I am seeking surfboard advice.

Some background:
I am not a beginner. I don't know what to call myself. I've been surfing for 23-ish years but I have never progressed past a certain point. I grew up in Hawaii but I don't shred. I know my way around a wave but I'll always be part kook. I learned on a crusty old '70s 7'6" pintail semi-gun. I surfed shore breaks, town and country on that thing. It was very fast but very thick and floaty as was the style for those boards. In the early 90's, I eventually upgraded to a used fat man's thruster. As a lightweight young adult it floated me like a longboard. I surfed some terrifying waves on that thing and pretty much scared myself out of the water for a while after an unwise session and a long time under water. Eventually I transferred to a university in a landlocked state and was only home in the Islands for holidays. On those trips home I borrowed or rented longboards and fell in love with the glide and the easy paddling. After graduating and moving to New York City, then various Long Island towns I stayed with long boards. Now in Torrance, California I'm still riding the last board I bought in New York 12 years ago. It was a barely used 9'6" x 23" x 3.25" single with a forgiving rocker. Lots of float on that boat. Now, 12 years later it's still my main ride from ankle-biters to head high.

The present:
My surfing frequency has always had ebbs and flows -- sometimes due to chronic/recurring injuries and sometimes due to apathy. Right now I'm in a flow phase and I'm reinvigorating my love for surfing. When I surf a lot, I feel better about everything. The problem that I'm having lately is that I'm starting to feel limited by my old log. It's fine for a lot of breaks and conditions, but for juicier waves it's too damned slow. On many steeper waves, if I can't get up early, top turn and speed through the initial section on the nose, then I'm screwed. When I drop in more vertically and bottom turn I often can't catch up with the shoulder. No matter how hard I pump I keep getting stuck just behind. My theory is that my banana rocker'd board just bogs down on the flats plus it has no drive. I feel like I need a flatter board for more speed. I also feel like I'd enjoy a looser, livelier, drivier board. And, I'd also like a board that fits nicely inside my hatchback. 8'6" or shorter works for that desirement.

Sooooooo.....
Here's the thing. I've gotten used to floating and paddling pretty high on the water. I weigh 200 lb (91 kg or 14ish stone). Not super big, I know, but big enough to sink most shortboards. I've borrowed and tried some smaller boards (fun shapes and mini-mals) and hate the feeling of being so low in the water. It probably didn't help that these were banana rocker'd beginner boards as well.

Any advice on dimensions or shapes for a transitional board that might click for a 40 year old 200-lb buoyancy addict trying to get off the foam? I understand that I'll need to get my paddling muscles into a different kind of condition to effectively use a less floaty board, but if the ride is worth it, I'm willing to put in some work.

Thanks.

[drowningbitbybit]

I've been surfing for 23-ish years but I have never progressed past a certain point. ... I know my way around a wave but I'll always be part kook.

I know that feeling

I recently got a much larger volumed board, but I was coming from the other end of the scale. I can comfortably surf a 6'2 (me: 6ft, 80-odd kilos) but kept missing too many waves or getting worn out too quickly, so I upscaled to a 6'10 x 21 x 2 3/4. To a longboarder, that'll sound tiny, but to me it felt massive. But after a few weeks of transition, I really like it now and can catch waves I couldn't have dreamt of on a tiny board. It takes more work to swing it around, but it does swing.

It doesn't sound like you'd want to go that small, but a bigger version, a performance mini-mal if you like, might suit you.

[dtc]

I went through a similar thing to you, but from a different angle - a late starter who wanted to go shorter but stay high volume as I dont get in the water enough to go too short (and am old and fairly big - about 85kg). I ended up with a custom board, but there are a few board around mid-7ft that I reckon you could give a go. So here is my blather from what I found in my research...

The first thing to think about is whether you want a mini mal shape (rounded nose and straight rails) or more a hybrid shape (pointer nose with rounded egg shape). The former is easier to surf but the latter is more manouverable.

(by the way, when I mention boards in this comment, I'm mentioning boards for the purporse of further research and which are available to look at on the web, not because I mean these exact boards ie just so you can get an idea. However, some of the boards are widely available if you want to buy off the rack; if you want to get a shaped board then they are a good research tool to start your shaping discussion)

In the mini mal category there are boards like the Walden mini mega magic (quite high volume - check out the 7ft 6, massive 74l volume). There are obviously other mini mal shapers and makes around which do much the same job (but perhaps not quite the same volume).

If you are intersted in the minimal shape/type of board, I suggest looking for a board that has a fairly pulled in tail (eg my board, which is is here viewtopic.php?f=20&t=15393&start=280 about 1/2 way down, you can't miss the colours... anyway, rounded nose, wide, flat rocker, fairly thick, pulled in tail and, although you cant really see it from the photos, quite hard rails towards the tail). The Takayama scorpion is another model even more radical; although its probably too small for you but you can see the nature of the outline I am talking about. The McTavish Carver and even his Eightball are other options (http://www.mctavish.com.au/surfboards-buy/midlength) which are probably lower volume. I'm sure most good longboard makers will have something similar in their line up.

The second category is the hybrid shape, and again there are a couple of boards worth looking at to start off with. The Firewire Addvance is a big fat hybrid board that appears to fit the bill, as does the 7S Superfish. The Superfish gets a lot of good comments and its a board that might be worth a good look for you given that you do have a skilled background in surfing; the Addvance is popular as well and I was very close to getting it myself. Again these boards have fairly low rocker, are wide and thick. They are probably 'higher' performance than the mini mal shapes, but as mentioned probably not quite as easy to surf.

A left field choice could be something like the Mccoy Nugget, which is a fairly unique board but some people love it. I'm not sure how available they are in the USA tho.

Anyway, if you have made it this far, I've thrown a few board names around. Basically there are the mini mals but you want one that are a bit thicker than normal, flatter rocker and higher performance than the standard NSP style mini mals. These are, I guess, shorter long boards, essentially, but retaining volume and made with some thought rather than just cutting 2ft off a longboard. And then there are the long hybrids/fish, which are more like longer shortboards.

Finally, the guy who shaped my board is unfortunately no where near you, but he specialises in higher volume boards for the bigger/older guys, so his website is worth a look. Its a bit hyperbolic, but his board shapes and dimensions will be useful as part of your research -check out here http://www.grantmillersurfboards.com.au/

You will see the 'performance' mini mal (the Powerglide, the one I have) and his version of the 'hybrid' board (the Waterskate). A board like either of these, in the mid 7ft area, I reckon will do you perfectly.

Good luck - board searching is fun and frustrating; but there are definitely options out there for you.

[spindlehead]

Wow! Thanks for the awesome responses guys.

And thank you very much, dtc, for those board examples. I came across a couple of those in my research but a few of them are totally new to me. I will add them to the research pile. As you ended up doing, I am considering a custom board also. There's a local shaper that intrigues me. Wayne Okamoto of Oak Foils Designs is known as sort of outlaw shaper and he seems to put a high priority on customer body type, fitness level, experience and performance desires, as well as local surf conditions. And then there's a new McTavish Carver SLX on sale at a local distributor for $500 USD. Seems like a pretty good deal... Fun indeed.

[dtc]

Quite a few of my friends have the Carver (although over here, Australia, we get the PU version from McTavish himself, so slightly different) - its a pretty good performer by all accounts and from my sessions with them, but they all say it works best from about chest high and above. So if you are happy to get back on the longboard for under waist high, it could be an option. It is lower volume than many of the alternatives, of course.

[IB_Surfer]

After getting a 5'10 twin, 6'8 twin, 6'8 quad I finally ended up with this, my 6'3 x 3 x 22 retro fish in epoxy. I am also 200lbs but I use this as my longboard replacement, and it rocks. Also, do a quad setup, I used twins for small surf and the quads for bigger surf.

I also had a 6'8 that paddled better but like this performance much more. And, as you see by what I had, you can probably go down to a 5'10 no problem, but like you I wanted float, not another shortboard, so this did it for me.

[spindlehead]

edit: This turned out to be a (typical) long winded spindle post, but there IS a couple of questions at the end.

IB_Surfer- That's a pretty sweet ride. I've seen bigger/older guys killing it on those quads up here too. 6'3 might be a little short for my current fitness level tho...lol.

I have been mixing it up a bit lately to hopefully get a better idea of what will suit me. My girlfriend has an 8'6 single mini-log that she gave up trying to learn on and I've taken it out a couple of times. The dimensions are 8'6 x 22 x 3 and notionally it should be a goer for me, however it paddles and rides like an air mattress. On closer inspection the 3" thickness is only at the stringer. The deck is highly domed/tapered, so most of that potential volume isn't really there. It almost seems like someone was trying to salvage a thrashed blank. Entirely possible since the shop she bought it from circa (2006-2007) kept emphasizing that it shaped from a Clark blank.

I also have an 8'0 high-performance mini that I "inherited" from a previous girlfriend around the time I got my trusty 9'6. She bought it in Haleiwa and brought it all the way to New York, then abandoned it with me and I have been dragging it around for over a decade. I've tried it a handful of times over the years. It's actually a pretty sweet board -- T&C branded 8'0 x 21 x 2-5/8 thruster-tail and signed by T&C's head shaper Glenn Pang. This was originally someones "small Sunset" board. I took it out into some punchy shoulder-ish high beach break a few days ago. Flotation did not exist but it seemed to paddle way better than the 8'6. And... duck dives... how I have forgotten... kooky at them but still, what a difference getting outside.

Anyhow, it took a while to figure out where to sit, when to paddle etc, but I eventually got few clean frontsides (ate a bit of sand along the way). I had totally forgotten the thruster feeling. Nifty trick that setup -- the board reacts to you brain faster than it reacts to your feet. I'd also forgotten that side-slippy feeling of dropping in late, pulling hard, sliding laterally down the wall, then locking into the pocket. Neato.

I think I could get used to that 8'0 for punchy waves like the other day but I'm pretty certain I'd be flailing about on a mushier wave. It's given me some confidence about wave my catching ability on less foam though. I'd really like something sub-8'. Primarily because that size range fits easily inside my hatchback. I can get an exceptional deal on a 7'6 McTavish Carver either in traditional poly or SLX construction. The dimensions are 7'6 x 22 x 2-7/8. The SLX is supposed to be lighter for the same dimensions, which should translate in to a little more buoyancy. I have read some negative things about SLX construction, any experience here? Also, I believe both the poly and SLX versions available here are Chinese-built from McTavish design files by Global Surf Industries (GSI). Any experience in general with GSI produced boards?

Thanks,
Spindlehead

[Surf Hound]

My advice is to find a quality local shaper and give him your story. Being on the bigger side a quality board made to fit your level and desired result can make a huge difference in your sessions. I think smaller guys have a much broader range of boards to choose from but once someone hits 200lbs a custom board is of more importance. All of the shapers I have used have always got a kick out of working with me and helping me have more enjoyment in the water. My advice is find a quality local shaper, develop that relationship and enjoy your sessions 10 fold. I believe a good relationship with a shaper is super important, especially if you are a big guy. Not saying you small guys cant benefit from a shaper it just seems to me there are a ton of options for guys sub 200lb.

[spindlehead]

Yeah, in my heart that's the right thing to do... Just doesn't satisfy my desire for "NOW.".. lol. Ahhh. A lesson in patience.

[IB_Surfer]

McTavish makes beeffy cool boards, good choice

[spindlehead]

Good dialogue with local shaper, made deposit. 7'6 x 23 x 3.1 are the basic dims with actual foil and volume distro by shaper's judgment based on interview and current boards. I'm pretty psyched. 4x1 fin set-up will give me choices between quad, tri and single configs. Super stoked!! I will make updates as appropriate....

[IB_Surfer]

and post a pic when she comes in!

[dtc]

Sounds perfect. Just remember to allow a few sessions to get used to the different take off point etc; but otherwise it seems to be just what you want. Have you agonised over the spray
Paint job yet?

[spindlehead]

I will indeed post pics. The shaper actually posts pics to his blog of the shaped board before it goes out for paint and glassing and then after. For the paint job I have come up with a scheme that I like. It's based on a propulsion research aircraft that I was fortunate to work on earlier in my career. The sketch below is the basic concept I gave the shaper. (Oak Foils is the shaper's brand)

With so many fin configurations possible with the new board I have more questions so I'm going to start a new thread about fin choices and configs.

[dtc]

spray job will be one of a kind - I like having something on your board that is personal, rather than just pretty colours. I have a decal representing my kids; the spray job itself was either a throwback to my teenage years of the 80s or overly lurid, depending on who you ask.

[spindlehead]

Shape is done. Got a couple of weeks to wait for art and glass. Getting exited!

http://oakfoils.blogspot.com/2013/10/dyna-glyde-41-for-shannon.html

[surf patrol]

congrats spindlehead

[spindlehead]

Art and glass are done! I can't believe how great the airspray and lams came out. I am thoroughly stoked. I have to wait until the shaper digitizes the as-glassed board (part of his process), so another day or two until I can pick it up. gyarr.....

More pics here: http://oakfoils.blogspot.com/2013/11/cu ... annon.html

[Surf Hound]

I have a board with the same dimensions that I have had for awhile that I still use after a few days of surfing. Good paddler...

[IB_Surfer]

Channels in the bottom? That is totally retro! Dig it