Choose a backup board.

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Choose a backup board.

Postby BaNZ » Sat Sep 26, 2020 6:58 pm

I get to surf 2 to 3 times a week. Possibly even more if I can train up my stamina.

I now need a backup board as the locals are saying that it will take several weeks for board repairs here.

I only have a torq 9'0 board. I'm thinking of getting another torq longboard but I'm choose between a nose rider or a high performance board.

I can't really make up my mind as I've little experience with them. Any suggestions?

My local spot is a reef break and it is perfect for longboards. Wave is always gentle and thick in volume. I'm also leaning towards a lighter board because they walk down the cliff is brutal.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby BoMan » Sun Sep 27, 2020 7:08 pm

I let FUN drive my decisions like that. What do you enjoy more...riding on the nose or doing maneuvers?
"A person's sense of balance is measured by how he handles the unexpected." - Brian Herbert
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby waikikikichan » Sun Sep 27, 2020 8:41 pm

In the Motorcycling world, there is a saying that goes " Dress for the CRASH, not for the RIDE ".

You see guys riding in shorts and tank tops on their 1000cc sportbikes. Why ? Because they say "It's too hot".

Are you going to choose a board based on how easy it is to haul up and down the hill or based on how easy it is to ride in the waves ?
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby BaNZ » Mon Sep 28, 2020 5:02 pm

BoMan wrote:I let FUN drive my decisions like that. What do you enjoy more...riding on the nose or doing maneuvers?


I like them both. If the wave is small and in perfectly clean, I "try" and ride on the nose. In the perfect scenario. I want to get both boards.

waikikikichan wrote:Are you going to choose a board based on how easy it is to haul up and down the hill or based on how easy it is to ride in the waves ?


I have no concept on how the board weight will affect the ride quality. I just thought that epoxy board is durable and heavy. It wasn't until yesterday that I carried my friend's PU board with glassing? It was thin but probably heavier than my board.

After surfing the spot 3 times this week, my body has started to get used to the slope downhill.

My problem with this new spot is that I'm sitting in the lineup close to the shortboards. If I sit further outside with the longboards, once I catch the wave I worry about running overe the shortboards. The breaks are way too crowded and I don't trust my ability not to run them over. Because I'm sitting close to the shortboard, this is where the wave will most likely break on top of me and I don't know how to fix that? Ride a smaller board, get one with more rocker? Or just go further outside and sit with the longboards. Sitting close to the shortboard has it's bonus, quite often the guys further outside will let the smaller waves through.. Sometimes they are too small for the shortboard so this is where I can rack up the wave count.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby waikikikichan » Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:50 am

BaNZ wrote: get one with more rocker?

And what will that do ?
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby BaNZ » Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:58 pm

waikikikichan wrote:
BaNZ wrote: get one with more rocker?

And what will that do ?


I did some late drops where the nose of the board started to dig into the water. I would say 2 out of 5 times I would succeed on late drops but I had no control of the board. The other 3 times I would just get pummeled and lose the board. I think having a little more rocker would help?

When I look at how other surfer does it, they paddle paddle and they prop their upper body up. Look left and right to make sure they aren't dropping on anyone then they standup. Whereas when I'm surfing. It's paddle paddle, xxxxx I need to popup right now or I won't catch the wave. I can't prop myself up to look to left or right. I suppose this is timing? I don't get it why are the better surfers able to prop their upper body up for a good 5 seconds before they decide if they want to stand up or not.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby IB_Surfer » Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:25 pm

get the one you don't have now, so that you will have a choice when it is repaired
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby waikikikichan » Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:47 pm

BaNZ wrote:I did some late drops where the nose of the board started to dig into the water. I would say 2 out of 5 times I would succeed on late drops but I had no control of the board.

So your idea is to get a board with more rocker to help the nose not dig into the water and aid in you controlling the board more ? Doesn't that seem like you are trying to fix the ARROW and not the INDIAN ?

BaNZ wrote:When I look at how other surfer does it, they paddle paddle and they prop their upper body up. Look left and right to make sure they aren't dropping on anyone then they standup. Whereas when I'm surfing. It's paddle paddle, xxxxx I need to popup right now or I won't catch the wave. I can't prop myself up to look to left or right. I suppose this is timing? I don't get it why are the better surfers able to prop their upper body up for a good 5 seconds before they decide if they want to stand up or not.

Not only are they looking Left/Right, but more importantly, Up and Out, down the line. They are a step ahead ( sometimes two ) just like playing Chess. But in your case, you are stuck/frozen in the moment. While they are looking ahead, you are looking down at the nose.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby BaNZ » Wed Sep 30, 2020 2:39 pm

Not being able to control the board is due to doing late takeoff as I'm trying to keep the nose out of water and trying to see if I'm blocking anyone. When I had my funboard, I could do later takeoff as I assume it is due to having more rocker and smaller length.

With timing and being in the right position, I think I'll need a few more months until I can get that right. I know my paddling is much faster now as I can get to the lineup in half the time. It's weird how I've surfed for years and I've not noticed myself dragging my feet through the water. I think now that I can paddle stronger and faster, I notice little things like my feet or the leash pulling me back. Plus now I'm able to lean a little more forward on the board and keep the nose lower to the water to increase my paddling. I didn't used to do that.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby waikikikichan » Wed Sep 30, 2020 10:16 pm

BaNZ wrote:Not being able to control the board is due to doing late takeoff as I'm trying to keep the nose out of water


Why are you trying to "keep the nose out of the water" ? Isn't that counter-intuitive to your effort to go down the face of the wave ?

And again, how do you know the nose is going under ? Because your are staring at the nose and not looking down the line.

Question: Say the nose does go under a bit, what do YOU do versus what the good surfers do when the nose goes under at your local break ?
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby BaNZ » Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:01 am

waikikikichan wrote:
BaNZ wrote:Question: Say the nose does go under a bit, what do YOU do versus what the good surfers do when the nose goes under at your local break ?


When it becomes too steep. I don't see them paddle, they keep an eye on the wave then turn around quickly and as soon as the wave is ontop of them, they popup and ride it. I think they push the board down when they turn around so when it bounces backup, it launch them forward? Not sure if that makes any sense. Whereas if I'm in the same position as them, I'm paddling paddling then I'm heading straight towards the bottom as my nose goes directly into the water.

I tried their approach a few times, but I could only do it on waves that are smaller. Once it gets big I freeze up as I'm not used to not paddling for a wave. Plus it seems the timing needs to be good?
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby waikikikichan » Thu Oct 01, 2020 7:30 am

BaNZ wrote: When it becomes too steep. I don't see them paddle, they keep an eye on the wave then turn around quickly and as soon as the wave is ontop of them, they popup and ride it. I think they push the board down when they turn around so when it bounces backup, it launch them forward?


That is not answering the question I asked you. In your scenario, the nose does not go under.

Again, WHAT DO GOOD SURFERS DO WHEN THE NOSE GOES UNDER versus what you do when the nose of your board goes under ?

Maybe you actually don't know what good surfers do, so what do YOU normally do when that situation happens ?
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby BaNZ » Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:52 pm

I think my friend said they pull the board up when it goes under. I don't think I've seen good surfers going under. The ones I see are usually foamies or ones that surf worse than me.

I don't always do the same thing when the nose go under. Usually on smaller days I lean really far forward but I can recover from that. I will shuffle my body mid paddle and bring it back to balance then paddle harder. On bigger days, I force myself to popup then put my back feet on the fins to bring the nose up and try shuffle back to the mid of the board to go down the wave. Two different outcome, I fall forward as the board flips and I embrace my head to avoid getting hit by the board. Or I catch the wave and have no control for the initial 5 seconds while I'm shuffling my feet to ride the wave. My friends calls it the crab walk and ask me wtf am I doing.

In the past I arch my body back more to put weight behind. But that doesn't always work as my paddle becomes slower. The angle is just too great and I can't recover. Whereas these days I try different things out. My paddle is getting better, I sometimes paddle harder but I don't arch my back to bring the nose up the water. It works sometimes in certain conditions. Haven't really figured out why yet.

These days my nose dive is really rare now. Probably 1 per session. I wouldn't say I'm getting better at it, it's more of I'm more reluctant to take on steeper waves so I pass on most of the waves. The way I see it is that there is very little room for error and the break is always crowded. By having a board with more rocker, maybe it will allow me to catch the ones that I've not been able to. On bigger days, I do notice that I'm the only longboard with a rounded nose. Most of them are using something more pointy but I tried one of them a couple of years ago and did not like it.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby dtc » Sat Oct 03, 2020 2:17 am

As an aside, tail rocker can help with steep waves just as much as nose rocker, if not more. Because tail rocker lets you bring the nose up (by weighting the tail) and doesn’t allow the wave to lift the tail as much (lifting tail = nose goes down). This might give you an indication re wkk’s question - it’s not the board that is the problem, it’s not having the nose do the right thing.

Wanting more nose rocker is trying to make the board fix a technique issue. Sure it’s an option but remember the trade offs - eg much harder to paddle, slower, less stable.

It’s true that a rounded nose is harder to fit into a steep wave than a narrower nose (but of course there are other trade offs with narrower noses as well). If you were after a different board, I would look at one with a less wide nose rather than one with more rocker
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby oldmansurfer » Wed Oct 07, 2020 7:38 pm

BaNZ wrote:
waikikikichan wrote:
BaNZ wrote:Question: Say the nose does go under a bit, what do YOU do versus what the good surfers do when the nose goes under at your local break ?


When it becomes too steep. I don't see them paddle, they keep an eye on the wave then turn around quickly and as soon as the wave is ontop of them, they popup and ride it. I think they push the board down when they turn around so when it bounces backup, it launch them forward? Not sure if that makes any sense. Whereas if I'm in the same position as them, I'm paddling paddling then I'm heading straight towards the bottom as my nose goes directly into the water.

I tried their approach a few times, but I could only do it on waves that are smaller. Once it gets big I freeze up as I'm not used to not paddling for a wave. Plus it seems the timing needs to be good?

This is a no paddle takeoff technique and requires that you are in the exact right place to do it
So what is worse.... dying or regretting it for the rest of my life? Obviously I chose not regretting it.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby Naeco78 » Thu Oct 08, 2020 12:06 am

In steep, chest high waves, it usually requires you to angle the board toward the shoulder of the wave so that it doesn't nosedive. A longer board simply wont fit in the curvature of the wave, if you ride it straight down the face of a steep wave. Not sure if you're already doing that but just thought it might be worth mentioning.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby BaNZ » Fri Dec 18, 2020 5:29 pm

This week I went to a surf shop and said I'm interested in a new longboard as a backup and I want something that can go a little faster for the bigger days. The guy looked at me and said, what's wrong with my surfboard. I said I love it but it needs repair and I want something that can go faster. He asked me what board I have and the fin setup. He told me I don't need a new board, the current one is good enough. Possibly just a new set of fins with more rake. I'm puzzled because I was expecting him to try and sell me a new board.
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Re: Choose a backup board.

Postby shaaaaaan2020 » Fri Dec 18, 2020 9:33 pm

BaNZ wrote:This week I went to a surf shop and said I'm interested in a new longboard as a backup and I want something that can go a little faster for the bigger days. The guy looked at me and said, what's wrong with my surfboard. I said I love it but it needs repair and I want something that can go faster. He asked me what board I have and the fin setup. He told me I don't need a new board, the current one is good enough. Possibly just a new set of fins with more rake. I'm puzzled because I was expecting him to try and sell me a new board.


Great conversation here - I hear you on wanting a backup board. It sounds like you're doing great on your 9 ft. Maybe try an 8 ft version of the same board - same shape, just shrunken down a bit. It will feel familiar in the way it surfs - but have subtle differences that you can explore and open up different parts of the wave and your surfing. Will probably help with the pearling too.

Regarding burying the nose on takeoff - agreed: angling in is your best bet esp for a longer board. But it takes some practice. I struggled with burying the nose when I was getting back into surfing over the summer- I was on a much shorter board... but something that worked for me was just focusing on getting my weight back and over the fins. I wasn't even trying to turn into the wave - just spent one session - popping up, getting my weight and feet way back, going straight and holding on. I would still bail on popups after that - but bailed on a lot fewer of them. Kinda helped my body get the muscle memory to know what to do on steeper takeoffs. Anyway hope that helps.
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