Do i pop up too late?

[rpavich]

I was surfing the longboard forum and came across a post where the guy was saying that he was perling a lot and the following was posted in response:

paddle faster (do NOT do two double hand stokes), rather continue your alternating arm paddle but paddle harder, arch your back and pop up sooner. When I was learning, I was told if you are pearling, you missed your chance to pop up. Basically its a feel thing, one learns when to pop up by the feeling. You have not learned what it feels like as to when you should be popping up. My advice is to stop with the double hand strokes and pop up sooner. If you pop up and the wave passes you by then you were too soon, if you pearl, you are too late. You pop up in between those 2 feelings. Practice, paddle harder, arch your back, pop up. Eventually you will get it.

I was also posting that I don't get long rides and I suspect these two things are connected.

I was out surfing yesterday and the waves I got were larger than I'm used to and I perled a few times and had to pull back a few times because the waves were about to break. It seemed that if I started trying to catch the wave earlier I'd not catch it and if I waited it was too steep.

My method is to do the "few extra strokes to make sure" method and I'm wondering if that's the best advice. Should I instead try and pop up sooner so that two things happen:

1.) The wave isn't so steep.

2.) I get longer rides because I'm not using up my ride distance trying to catch the wave.

Should I forget the extra strokes and just pop up with confidence and If the wave passes me by then I keep trying to find that sweet spot between by-pass and perl?

[BaNZ]

When I first started surfing, they always tell you. Do that extra few strokes to make sure you catch it. Later on when I watch how other better surfers do it, some of them just do 2-3 stroke to catch the wave. It's because they are at the perfect spot. If you're at the wrong spot, that extra few strokes you do would ensure you nose dive as you're too late to popup.

Beach break is always hard to judge the perfect spot. Just keep trying and find where is the sweet spot. It took me several months before I master it. Hopefully it will be quicker for you.

[goatts]

I like to take off a little late and pop up quickly so I can angle down the wave face. Timing is going to vary depending on the wave period. Short period waves that are 5 to 7 seconds will tend to break fast and are tricky on a longboard. Practice a lot and develop muscle memory to figure out what works for you.

[rpavich]

Thanks guys!
The good part is trying is fun too! It's not like work (too much)

[krustyburger]

As an exercise, try to catch a wave and ride it in cobra pose (head and top half of body in push-up position with arms extended) all the way to the end of the line instead of trying to stand up.

You will clearly feel the point at which the wave begins to carry you and where you no longer need to paddle. Get into cobra pose then. Once in cobra pose engage a rail and head down the line without worrying about your pop-up. Unless it's a very soft spilling wave, the wave will get steeper and more hollow. Depending on the wave, there may be multiple seconds of time at which you can cruise in cobra, have a look around, and then pop-up. Keep in mind that it will be steeper and harder the longer you wait. This should help you get a "feeling" of how the wave breaks and enjoy a nice cruise down the line without the pressure of having to stand up.

[waikikikichan]

If you pop up and the wave passes you by then you were too soon, if you pearl, you are too late. You pop up in between those 2 feelings. Practice, paddle harder, arch your back, pop up. Eventually you will get it.

Technically I agree with that longboard forum post. BUT.........:
1) Practice - practice what ? practice a bad technique only makes you worse.
2) Paddle Harder - "Grip it and Rip it", huh ? No, No. You need to paddle SMARTER not Harder. Power, Position and Timing. Of the three, Position and Timing are most important.
3) Arch your back - at the right moment, maybe. But how do you know when that moment is ? I keep my chest down on the deck so that i can get my elbow deep into the water to get a fuller more powerful stroke.
4) Pop up - yeah, but again when ? Are you Popping up to both feet or one knee ? Chicken wing or crawl up ?

No where in that list do I see the recommendation to LOOK. Where you look is where you go.

[oldmansurfer]

Another instance when you pearl is when you aren't paddling fast enough and the wave is a lurching up shorebreak type of wave. The wave lifts the tail of your board simultaneously pushing the nose under.

[rpavich]

As an exercise, try to catch a wave and ride it in cobra pose (head and top half of body in push-up position with arms extended) all the way to the end of the line instead of trying to stand up.

You will clearly feel the point at which the wave begins to carry you and where you no longer need to paddle. Get into cobra pose then. Once in cobra pose engage a rail and head down the line without worrying about your pop-up. Unless it's a very soft spilling wave, the wave will get steeper and more hollow. Depending on the wave, there may be multiple seconds of time at which you can cruise in cobra, have a look around, and then pop-up. Keep in mind that it will be steeper and harder the longer you wait. This should help you get a "feeling" of how the wave breaks and enjoy a nice cruise down the line without the pressure of having to stand up.

Awesome I will give it a try!

[dtc]

2) Paddle Harder - "Grip it and Rip it", huh ? No, No. You need to paddle SMARTER not Harder. Power, Position and Timing. Of the three, Position and Timing are most important.
No where in that list do I see the recommendation to LOOK. Where you look is where you go.

This is how I like to think of it. You catch a wave using gravity, not the wave speed (the wave does push your board, but you catch the wave via gravity). You catch it by getting to the slope of the wave and sliding down the face (just like skiing or skateboarding down a hill). So that is position. You need to be in a position to slide down the face. As waikikichan says - position.

But the face is moving all the time and is changing all the time. So you need to hit the right spot at the right time. If you get to the face of the wave too early, its not steep enough and you cant slide down it. Get there too late and it will be too steep/the lip will crash on top of you. So timing is needed

So how do you get to the right spot at the right time? If you know waves, you can be in that spot from the start (no paddle take offs). But for most of us, we use paddling. If you are paddling too slowly, then the wave either goes underneath you (you miss it) or you are almost there but the wave picks up your tail and you nose dive.

Also, if you get to the right spot but pop up too early - the wave will pass underneath. If you pop up too late, you may perl (or may just belly ride down the face). But you still need to be in the right spot at the right time - and then get the pop up right as well

Arching your back is about weighting the rear of the board so that its not pushed up by the wave. This insta has an interesting shot toward the end showing how the weighting changes how the wave pushes on the board

https://www.instagram.com/p/CDwyiTDIUSb ... hare_sheet

[rpavich]

If you pop up and the wave passes you by then you were too soon, if you pearl, you are too late. You pop up in between those 2 feelings. Practice, paddle harder, arch your back, pop up. Eventually you will get it.

Technically I agree with that longboard forum post. BUT.........:
1) Practice - practice what ? practice a bad technique only makes you worse.
2) Paddle Harder - "Grip it and Rip it", huh ? No, No. You need to paddle SMARTER not Harder. Power, Position and Timing. Of the three, Position and Timing are most important.

That appears to be the case and I have to work on that for sure.

3) Arch your back - at the right moment, maybe. But how do you know when that moment is ? I keep my chest down on the deck so that i can get my elbow deep into the water to get a fuller more powerful stroke.
4) Pop up - yeah, but again when ? Are you Popping up to both feet or one knee ? Chicken wing or crawl up ?

Both feet chicken wing (at least that's what I think I'm doing and attempting to do. Reality could be waaaayyy offf.... lol

No where in that list do I see the recommendation to LOOK. Where you look is where you go.[/quote]

[rpavich]

2) Paddle Harder - "Grip it and Rip it", huh ? No, No. You need to paddle SMARTER not Harder. Power, Position and Timing. Of the three, Position and Timing are most important.
No where in that list do I see the recommendation to LOOK. Where you look is where you go.

This is how I like to think of it. You catch a wave using gravity, not the wave speed (the wave does push your board, but you catch the wave via gravity). You catch it by getting to the slope of the wave and sliding down the face (just like skiing or skateboarding down a hill). So that is position. You need to be in a position to slide down the face. As waikikichan says - position.

But the face is moving all the time and is changing all the time. So you need to hit the right spot at the right time. If you get to the face of the wave too early, its not steep enough and you cant slide down it. Get there too late and it will be too steep/the lip will crash on top of you. So timing is needed

So how do you get to the right spot at the right time? If you know waves, you can be in that spot from the start (no paddle take offs). But for most of us, we use paddling. If you are paddling too slowly, then the wave either goes underneath you (you miss it) or you are almost there but the wave picks up your tail and you nose dive.

Also, if you get to the right spot but pop up too early - the wave will pass underneath. If you pop up too late, you may perl (or may just belly ride down the face). But you still need to be in the right spot at the right time - and then get the pop up right as well

Arching your back is about weighting the rear of the board so that its not pushed up by the wave. This insta has an interesting shot toward the end showing how the weighting changes how the wave pushes on the board

https://www.instagram.com/p/CDwyiTDIUSb ... hare_sheet

thank you!

I can't wait to get out there again and keep this stuff in mind and try it.

[LostAtSea]

No where in that list do I see the recommendation to LOOK. Where you look is where you go.

This may sound like a solution to a different problem, but it's not. Make sure your head is up. It really helps your timing.

[IB_Surfer]

It's not that you are popping up too late, it's that you are not paddling hard enough pop up earlier. Work on keeping your head up and digging down when you paddle

[SandInMyPants]

It sounds as if you either paddle to slow, or begin to paddle too late.

1. Begin to paddle long before the wave get close to you and catches you. You have to create speed before the wave reaches you.

2. Create speed by moving a lot of water with your arms. Often people think they are paddling, yet, they are not moving and they don´t paddle hard enough.

These two things is often the reason why people can´t catch waves.

If you are popping up too late, try to turn the board a bit to the side the wave breaks, that might do it.

[waikikikichan]

If you are popping up too late, try to turn the board a bit to the side the wave breaks, that might do it.

Could you explain more in detail. Do you mean he should "Angle In" during the take off ?

[oldmansurfer]

Sometimes paddling difficulties come from positioning on the board. I guess a common mistake is to lay further back on the board in an attempt to avoid pearling. This actually makes it more likely to pearl as laying further back angles the nose up causing you to push more water when you paddle which makes it more difficult to get up to speed. I found recently that because I don’t surf every week I am not positioning exactly right when I lay down to paddle. So I had to pay attention to exactly where I was sitting on the board before I laid down to paddle so I was closer to the ideal position

[SandInMyPants]

If you are popping up too late, try to turn the board a bit to the side the wave breaks, that might do it.

Could you explain more in detail. Do you mean he should "Angle In" during the take off ?

Jep, Angle/Point the nose a bit to the side when popping up.

See clip from 8.30
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tm2ckYaeMw

If your chest and front-body points away from the wave-wall when popping up, you can grap the edge (rail) of the board on the side which is away from the wave. That can help prevent the nose to go under, and it will help you to keep your body in a low balance-point so you have more control.

see the clip at 1.46
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLBer1XsjNc

[waikikikichan]

[Jep, Angle/Point the nose a bit to the side when popping up.

BUT, the OP is already LATE popping up, trying to turn while still trying to get firmly planted ( and maybe the nose pointed up ), will probably have him stuck high up in the lip. If he was pointed down, gravity and momentum ( with the fins point in the direction ) will assist. Trying to turn without being in control and having the side of the fins now catching the energy of the water rushing up the face, will just throw him (now sideways ) over with the lip.

See clip from 8.30

Oh, that guy ......... he normally doesn't deal with long board problems, but he can get you " Surfing Like a Pro in 25 Minutes ".

If your chest and front-body points away from the wave-wall when popping up, you can grap the edge (rail) of the board on the side which is away from the wave. That can help prevent the nose to go under, and it will help you to keep your body in a low balance-point so you have more control.

"Grabbing Rail" is a more advanced technique. I wouldn't recommend it for beginners to use. Why ? Like as you said "keep your body in a low balance-point", ( which sometimes is good ) but ends up creating the bad habit of squatting and the dreaded "stink bug" stance. Better to have the legs soft and extended, used to absorb the whitewater like shock absorbers versus compressed and locked out.

[SandInMyPants]

[Jep, Angle/Point the nose a bit to the side when popping up.

BUT, the OP is already LATE popping up, trying to turn while still trying to get firmly planted ( and maybe the nose pointed up ), will probably have him stuck high up in the lip. If he was pointed down, gravity and momentum ( with the fins point in the direction ) will assist. Trying to turn without being in control and having the side of the fins now catching the energy of the water rushing up the face, will just throw him (now sideways ) over with the lip.

See clip from 8.30

Oh, that guy ......... he normally doesn't deal with long board problems, but he can get you " Surfing Like a Pro in 25 Minutes ".

If your chest and front-body points away from the wave-wall when popping up, you can grap the edge (rail) of the board on the side which is away from the wave. That can help prevent the nose to go under, and it will help you to keep your body in a low balance-point so you have more control.

"Grabbing Rail" is a more advanced technique. I wouldn't recommend it for beginners to use. Why ? Like as you said "keep your body in a low balance-point", ( which sometimes is good ) but ends up creating the bad habit of squatting and the dreaded "stink bug" stance. Better to have the legs soft and extended, used to absorb the whitewater like shock absorbers versus compressed and locked out.

I have to disagree with you on this one. If a person can´t paddle up the wave the keyword is speed. Speed by beginning to paddle in good time before the wave reaches the surfer. The trick is to move a lot of water with your arms to create speed.

If a person nosedives often, I have found, as in the video, that going on the wave with an angle can sometimes help instead of nosediving.

Grapping the rail helps me stay low and maintain balance.

If the person still falls over or nosedives, the person might be leaning to much forward on the board during take off.
If put your weight on the back foot during take off.

[oldmansurfer]

That video of the beginner surfer grabbing rail is illustrative of how copying a pro isn't useful. He is clueless as to why J O B is grabbing rail going left but he's going to do it anyway because of imaginary benefits.