narcissism in surfing?

[LostAtSea]

Hi guys, I think I've read over a dozen times since I started surfing about how "selfish" the activity is. I've heard a few guys parrot this on the beach too.

I'm not sure what this is all about. How is surfing more selfish than, say, any other sport? Watching TV? Taking a nap? Putting hot sauce on a Taco? Going for a swim? ...or arguably every other human endeavour?

I'm not saying it's altruistic. Sure, we are out there catching waves while homeless people struggle and children starve, but come on...Is everyone who is NOT surfing spending every waking moment attacking world hunger? Certainly not.

I suspect it's some sort of self-deprecating humility that is supposed to come off as "sensitivity" to others? Not sure....can anyone enlighten me on this?

https://www.google.ca/#q=surfing+selfish

[oldmansurfer]

Narcissism does not translate to selfishness. But that aside basically surfing is made up of individuals. There will be every variation of personality and every variety of mental disorder. There may be a large number of selfish or narcissistic in surfing these days but not that I can see (not at my break) Surfing like video games can be addicting to the point of destroying jobs, personal relationships, educational activities, just about every aspect of you life can be ruined if you give in to the desire to surf over other activities. But if you ask me from my own personal experience I would say hands down that video games are much worse.

[LostAtSea]

Hmmm..maybe narcissism wasn't the right perspective on this (although I agree, there are narcissists who surf, as well as in other activities).

You might be on to something though....maybe it's referring to those who are all consumed by the sport...like a drug addict who screws over those who are close to get a fix. I don't usually hear it in that context however, but that may be the crux.

I don't have experience with video gamers, but sure...if anything is done to the extreme if has potentially negative effects.

I gotta say, surfing with my daughter (which involves me pushing her into knee-deep waves) is a whole lotta fun too.

Now, one could argue that having kids is a selfish endeavour, therefore teaching my daughter to surf is somehow self-serving. ...but that would take me back to my original question...how is surfing any more or less selfish than anything else we do?

[pmcaero]

Surfing like video games can be addicting to the point of destroying jobs, personal relationships, educational activities, just about every aspect of you life can be ruined if you give in to the desire to surf over other activities

If you can surf that much, though, you probably are ripped So that's a bonus

[oldmansurfer]

Maybe or maybe you have Malaria and reef and coral and fin cuts and dislocations and fractures, arthritis, tendonitis, skin cancer, pterygeums, swimmers ear, etc

[oldmansurfer]

Surfers in Hawaii used to have a bad reputation due to cutting school to go surf, calling in sick from work to go surf and similar issues. However I never cut school or work to surf. There are probably lots of people who are similarly responsible.....well at least when it comes to surfing. However I did ask to get off from work to go surf and was allowed to. Reading a book now that is selfish since it's entirely an individual experience (unless you read aloud.) One you might read to shed some light on the lengths people go to to surf is Barbarian Days

[LostAtSea]

Maybe or maybe you have Malaria and reef and coral and fin cuts and dislocations and fractures, arthritis, tendonitis, skin cancer, pterygeums, swimmers ear, etc

Sounds like a fair deal for some reelin' reef breaks.

[jaffa1949]

Uncle Jaffa channeling Yoda, Yogis and assorted surfed surf gurus mentors etc.
"Feel the force". Obi Wan Kenobi
"support the revolution, go surfing " Nat Young mark1.
"The best surfer is the one having the most fun" ???????
better unsaid, the froth of, "the gnarly dude" representing the wholly intellectual side of surfing.
"Locals Only" Lunada Bay self entitled heavies facing their day in a Californian Court.
I would argue that a committed surfer is more likely a fixated hedonist, all the other wide range appellations of human nature tacked on top of that.

My question is why are they all out at my break on the best day of the year!

[LostAtSea]

Surfers in Hawaii used to have a bad reputation due to cutting school to go surf, calling in sick from work to go surf and similar issues. However I never cut school or work to surf. There are probably lots of people who are similarly responsible.....well at least when it comes to surfing. However I did ask to get off from work to go surf and was allowed to. Reading a book now that is selfish since it's entirely an individual experience (unless you read aloud.) One you might read to shed some light on the lengths people go to to surf is Barbarian Days

Yea, cutting responsibilty to surf may not be productive (except in improving your cutback), but I would'nt describe that as "selfish" - maybe irresponsible. As a surfer, I have a hard time seeing a problem with cutting a day here and there to celebrate riding waves. It is, after all, an awesome thing to do, and life is short.

I read Barbarian Days, and really dug it too. William Finnegan is another example of someone who calls surfing a selfish endeavor.

I dunno - I just don't see it that way. Its not the word I would use to describe it. Ithink you are correct in saying it stems from the addiction of surfing and letting all other priorities fall away. Still, selfish is a poor descriptor IMO.

Open to other opinions on this.

[oldmansurfer]

surfing is a lot of things to a lot of people. For Finnegan it was a selfish endeavor. For you it is not. There is no common denominator. It's what you make it.

[LostAtSea]

surfing is a lot of things to a lot of people. For Finnegan it was a selfish endeavor. For you it is not. There is no common denominator. It's what you make it.

I think surfing itself is more objective.

One person might be thinking, "I could hang out with my kids today, but even though I haven't spent a minute with them in weeks, I'm going to go surfing!" I would say THAT is selfish.

However, you could insert any activity into that sentence. The act of surfing itself isn't selfish, it's the dissing of other people that makes it selfish.

I tend to think it's off base to refer to surfing as a selfish act. It may be more correct for Finnegan (for example) to say, "I'm selfish, oh, and by the way, I surf too."

[oldmansurfer]

It's more like "I care more about surfing than you or other things in my life" or for me "I don't care more about surfing than you" Outside of surfing Finnegan may be a generous person. How someone behaves surfing doesn't define their entire existence. Or vice versa. Even Finnegan wasn't consumed night and day with surfing.

[billie_morini]

JJ,
You've read over a dozen times about how "selfish" the activity is? Maybe you have. If so, then I will disagree over a dozen times it is NOT selfish. There are no greater joys than appreciating the natural world and its wonders. Additionally, surfing promotes good health, which is good for your loved ones in the long run because you can care better and longer for them.

With regard to the English language, the words selfish and narcissism do not share the same definition. I can boldly state this because some of my work is heavily published!
billie

[LostAtSea]

JJ,
You've read over a dozen times about how "selfish" the activity is? Maybe you have. If so, then I will disagree over a dozen times it is NOT selfish. There are no greater joys than appreciating the natural world and its wonders. Additionally, surfing promotes good health, which is good for your loved ones in the long run because you can care better and longer for them.

With regard to the English language, the words selfish and narcissism do not share the same definition. I can boldly state this because some of my work is heavily published!
billie

Yeah, I'm on the side that says it may be a lot of things, but "selfish" is not really one of them. When I said narcissistic I guess I was referring to the "It's all about me" kind of narcissism. I can only guess that's what is being talked about.

In another example, I just read Chas Smith's book about the North Shore and he uses words like selfish, narcissistic, ego-driven, to describe surfing/surfers. He may be generalizing, but I think it's more the people involved (in the small world he's describing) rather than the activity itself

[Big H]

Chas Smith is a sensationalist....he was also writing about the world of pro surfing which is an entirely different animal. There are no teams, each person is their own potential "brand".

Don't hate the player, hate the game.....

[Dex101]

I have never heard this so really interesting to hear.

Couple of points I can think of:

Surfing is an individual past time that can be done at the same time as others (so surfing with friends or family) there by surfing in its self is you pursuing the act of surfing for your own enjoyment (could be described as selfish) HOWEVER, so would every other activity that is done by an individual, and I think this would be laughable for the general idea of calling it selfish in a negative way.

Surfing competitively creates a more negative selfish feel as you want to be the best surfer you can be against someone else. With things like running, thats no problem, the world is big enough for everyone to run at the same time (don't quote me on that). With surfing due to the changeable weather and swell the finite number of waves on a certain day do lead to some people acting in a selfish manner (snaking, dropping in etc). Whilst we would all love for people to share waves completely selflessly there is a happy medium we can live with.

Surfers stereotypically are often seen as very selfless, thinking about being environmentally concious etc.

How a person acts about any activity, hobby or object is down to that person, not the item in question unless that item can cause addiction (in which case, is it selfish?) Someone who goes out running regularly for an hour an evening, are they being selfish with their time? probably not to them but maybe if their partner has to do all the cleaning... Same can be said financially. If someone spends £1000's on their car, this isnt selfish (as its their hard earned cash) unless they should be using that money elsewhere. By this I mean child support payments, not that the wife wants a new outfit!

Surfing is an activity that people tend to get involved with quite intensively (learning to surf, as I know too well, isnt quick, easy or something you can dabble in) so it requires a lot of someones time to get to a level and also stay at that level. Now if people are able to balance that time and money, that surfer isnt selfish.

[jaffa1949]

What a load of First World Problem! Stop thinking about the psychoanalysis of anyone else's motives. Choose your own motive, take care of the daily stuff and then go surfing. ............FIXED.

I come out of the surf in a better frame of mind than went in!
Remember SURF washes cleaner whiter and brighter!

[oldmansurfer]

I think it's fun to consider things related to surfing when one is not surfing. But yeah you make surfing what it is to you so whatever anyone else thinks about it shouldn't really matter. What Kelly Slater says....Just surf.

[BoMan]

"One's destination is never a place but rather a new way of looking at things." - Henry Miller

When I was a runner, I enjoyed training much more than competition. I looked forward to feeling the endorphins of a fully engaged body, the company of friends, and the scenery one can appreciate so much better from the side of the road than in a speeding car.

I find the same rewards in surfing..and can do it into my 80's!

[LostAtSea]

What a load of First World Problem! Stop thinking about the psychoanalysis of anyone else's motives. Choose your own motive, take care of the daily stuff and then go surfing. ............FIXED.

I come out of the surf in a better frame of mind than went in!
Remember SURF washes cleaner whiter and brighter!

My OP was intended as light banter - Merely commentary regarding surf media, which can be fun at times. I am interested in others opinions and I appreciate the ones I got here, yours included.

Thanks for bringing up William Finnegan OMS, he probably explains his "selfishness" the best. Chas Smith's book focuses more on the narcissism, that being the money driven WSL, and the North Shore Hierarchies.

As I was reading through Finnegan's book, he comes back to surfing as a selfish act numerous times. Even in the pages of his book, I was never clear why he thought of surfing as being selfish. Sure, he talks about being an individual in the line-up, even among other surfers, or surf travel (leaving others behind), but as Jaffa brought up earlier, surfing is what you make of it. Surfing itself isn't selfish, only the surfer has that potential.

To me personally I have no need to justify my surfing, only to say it makes me super happy and appreciative of life. So, I'm always a little confused when someone states surfing is a selfish thing to do.