Please! Do something about the Bournemouth Reef hype!!!

[market-research]

Brent ,

The defending of the results even when they may clearly not be there may be a function of any consultants duty to his indemnity insurance.

That is similar to a car accident where "admission of liability" voids one of cover.

1. Were ASR engaged consultants for the Mount reef?
2. did they have a duty of care and diligence to its design?
3. did they make disclosures of what their design was to produce?
4. is there a body that oversaw the consultants (if that is what they were) duties and obligations?
5. was there a contract that defined what those duties and obligations were?
6. has anybody looked at whether under the terms of such contact (if it existed) anyone has been negligent or inept/incompetent at what capabilities or skills they were taking a fee for. (if they took a fee)

Point 6 is highly dependent on a number of things and merely asks a question -it does not for a moment pre-empt the answer or suggest any deficiencies.

All of these points are faced by architects / designers /builders / developers on a daily basis globally and are nothing new.

Unbridled demand for a outcome (whether it is possible or not) is usually the result of market "salting".

There is a famous example of such a marketing exercise that is a textbook perfect example. The "poisidon" nickel shares in Australia in the 60's where its believed "salting" of the market by rumour and what the market wanted to hear made and lost fortunes . "salting" of the assay samples may also have been involved.

This is not in the least comparable to ASR's as fortunes are not what the market was seeking. The market here is seeking the "holy grail" or "knee height to overhead" of waves for its 'self gratification".

The vulernabilty of a surfers "self gratification" is akin to the obsession of always seeking the highest high and those that exploit it. The markets providors call it "satisfying a demand" , marketers can refer to it as a market vulnerability than can be exploited.

Many examples of unethical, inhumane and some say plain dishonest marketing campaigns are used throughout the world to "pass off" many products for many markets where the products are nothing like what the consumer thinks he wants and needs. Selling by "illusion" is nothing new.

Whether or not the market was manipulated using this vulnerability or weakness being used as an oppurtunity is a long bow to draw but some of the classic signs seem to be in Brents listing of points .

When the market finally seeks and "distills " all of this information that is getting compiled is when good solid judgements can be made on the full activities , intentions and capabilities of all concerned.

There is clear evidence that the market is "done" with promises and a ticket to the utopia of perfect surf and "it will be good when its finished". reports in surfing magazines and amongst the professional surfing area certainly suggest that reality is a priority and the reality of the near past is unfolding.

There is a clear perception amongst all that I contact and that contact me that ASR's have much ground to make up if they are ever to be thought of again as a viable way of being a positive cost/benefit to the coast or its users.

This perception is held from the top down to normal beach users as the "failures" brent speak of become known.

We are not seeing articles of the continuous perfect waves breaking and the happy smiles of local people asking for more of the same.

God knows we all wish we were!


Whether ASR's end up in history as another "yo-yo" craze or "happy meal" to "hook" customers is what this research (that looks like becoming a book) is about - no malice or ill will here at all , no lying, coniving, misrepresentation , casting false dispersion, false or misleading information, undue spin, seeking and exploiting vulerabilities, dividing surfers and communities, slight of hand illusion painting , trust me - I know, what would you know, better be quick as someone else wants it for more, better be quick as the neighboring town wants their's first, you can be the first on your block with a new yo-yo, you will feel good if you order one now -is what this book is about at all.

as Joe Friday said "just the facts"

It will ONLY publish well authenticated facts that are indisputable on easy seeking. It will refrain from inflammetry comments that are meant to offend and only stick to what in everyday we say as WHAT HAPPENED?.

factual and well intended information is welcome in all its forms as is well documented conversations that have been witnessed in public meetings.

So what say ye?
M_R

[Brent]

Lets just wait & see what happens, the proof will be in the pudding as they say. I don't have the personal time to reply to your post with something respectfully pondered & thoughtful.

Whatever happens it'll be well watched eh?

[kitesurfer]

*does bagpuss impression*

KS

[market-research]

yes
by many


M_R

[RJD]

market-research do you surf?

[market-research]

only for half a century
that makes me an "old fart" huh?


M-R

it took 47 before i grew up though

[Realwaves]

To ALL

M R sounds like he might run the company. His constant spin on things makes us all think, if more time was spent trying to rectify projects to which your company has failed to complete , projects you admitted failing but blaming someone else and fixing YOUR created problems , again instead of blaming others , then you might get it right.

Through my experience with the members of this company in their OTHER initatives , this project is doomed also, it will get to hard and they will walk away.
Look at their contract even if they get this wrong (which is looking very likely) they lose a minimal amount of the contract.

People should be looking at the idoit that signed the deal as we know these Kooks building the reef (if thats what its called) will meet their own demise , very very soon and very very public.

Leave the sport alone ........ Kooks.

[Brent]

I tend to agree with the last poster. Hi & I know who you are :-)

I suspect MR is actually Kerry Black, Mr ASR himself.
Thus my not taking his bait above.

Yep, one can talk & fill posts with words ASR guy, but as you said above "Joe Friday said just the facts".

Facts are,
Our reef is still not finished.
You've run out of money.
It was poorly project managed. Almost negligently so.
You over hyped in the media to get local buy-in & support - I have the clippings in front of me. BOP Media didn't spin it...you're smiling in the clippings & being quoted, talking nonsense like a snake oil salesman.

And you're off over there doing it all over again having not learned a thing for your experiences here.

Anyway, I hope Bournemouth recieves a better resolved & completed project from you - or ASR are toasted I suspect. Good luck.

[kitesurfer]

To ALL

M R sounds like he might run the company. His constant spin on things makes us all think, if more time was spent trying to rectify projects to which your company has failed to complete , projects you admitted failing but blaming someone else and fixing YOUR created problems , again instead of blaming others , then you might get it right.

Through my experience with the members of this company in their OTHER initatives , this project is doomed also, it will get to hard and they will walk away.
Look at their contract even if they get this wrong (which is looking very likely) they lose a minimal amount of the contract.

People should be looking at the idoit that signed the deal as we know these Kooks building the reef (if thats what its called) will meet their own demise , very very soon and very very public.

Leave the sport alone ........ Kooks.

Oh good another anoymous new poster on this thread, just what we need!
I'm touched by your concern over a stretch of coastline that is half way round the world from you guys but if you really think MR works for the company why do you keep bringing this thread back up? Let it go.
The reef here isn't a big issue in either the surfing comunity or the kitesurfing comunity, no ones under the illusion that we're going to have to rename the beach to puertoesconboscombe or that we're going to get 15ft breakers. Everyone is just going to wait and see, plus winters just around the doorstep so it going to be at least another 6-8months before its anywhere near finished.
Please don't let this thread run that long!

KS

[Realwaves]

Kiteman

Whilst this company and the Kooks that run it are still near the sport of surfing these threads (and trust us any other threads inline with their projects) will continue.

The public and surf communities need to know their proven (and self admitted) failed track record, NOT the crap they spin in public meetings whereas they ask grommets to stand on street corners and yell in support of building (well starting but never completing) these things after promising those groms a wave half as good as Pipe and taking boat wakes and making them overhead ridable peaks !!!!!!.

Their constant mishaps (to which are never their fault) are taking away the possibilities of REAL companies having the ability in the future of creating positive things for the sport (and its offspins) for all to benefit.

Quit while you are behind as you will just continue to go backward and take the sport many love with you.

All will be public very very soon . Good luck in meeting your deadline for this project, OH YEAH thats right you didnt calculate that the weather in that part of the world is not always perfect. NOT YOUR FAULT.

KOOKS

[market-research]

sorry KS , i beg to differ but there are calls to form "sister' relationships with ummm Malibu .. i believe. Its a part of the marketing strategy .

Which by the way is ok if its taken as "tongue in cheek by all concened and the "tourists " are the one who see some "fun" in it.

but the serious "malipulation" of peoples vulnerablities being exploited for personal gain is a bit "sus' from any point of view.

its a bit scary as to what is unfolding with property values and the ability to find buyers that also would like 'emporers clothes' by the sea -most of the difference between "real values" and those represented by "derivatives" (look derivative on wiki and see the difference on a graph) are being suffered by those that thought they had real wealth to buy.

An honest and good attempt to reestablish a town as a coastal "spa" has been apparently started with a $250k reef that ibecame more than 10 times overbudget after all was put in place (and it could not be reversed.)

Has this "clicked' with anyone yet?? The town, people , commerce were all fully committed when the final cost to complete was signed onto?

This seems to be marketing of the most "clever" kind.

And then on top of this there is doubt about when it will be finished? How well will it be finished? How well it will perform? When will conditions for wind, swell, crowds and of course time of day be their best for a enjoyeable time?

Amongst all this are a crew of workers who have been drafted and are being paid to do as they are told that we have no doubt are blameless and are trying their best to bring about a good outcome.

Only the people of Mt Maunaganui and Opanke can answer if the wealth that their reefs were to bring to their communities (who "put out" so much ) has eventuated or if there is any return for their investment at all.

Ive just been sent a transcript of a TV inteview on Austalian TV where the words " and of course everybody is stoked " about the MT reef - the text being part of narration by a person that has a great deal to gain in having a tv report making out that the Mount Reef was a "great sucess" that all the mount people are "stocked about it "

The mount people on this forum may not know of this as the people who may have been influenced in paying 10 times more may not think the TV report was anything less than it represented.

The sad thing is that it was a "surfing science report" that quoted those words and I have no doubt that the narration was supplied by the "scientist" being inteviewed. This is a bit "sus".

What a horrible set of circumstances that suggest possible marketing missbehaviour of the worst kind.

I guess thats what happens when everyone believes that WOMD did really exist and its then ok to say anything to convince anybody about anything.



M_R

[drowningbitbybit]

Good, so we're all agreed then - putting reefs where they dont work isnt such a great idea, and that money makes the world go round but not necessarily in the right direction.

So we can put this one to bed now? Please?

[market-research]

what about my research on the topic?

m_r

[kitesurfer]

sorry KS , i beg to differ but there are calls to form "sister' relationships with ummm Malibu .. i believe. Its a part of the marketing strategy .

Hmmm.

I haven't actually bothered to read your reply but i strongly suspect that there is nothing in it that relates to the reef here in bournemouth, just a lot of verbal dioheria so i am at a loss as to how you beg to differ as i have not given any views on any reefs or marketing guff.
But i suppose you think the glass is always half empty, whereas i believe it is always half full, maybe thats what you were refering too?

KS

[market-research]

"The reef here isn't a big issue in either the surfing comunity or the kitesurfing comunity, no ones under the illusion that we're going to have to rename the beach to puertoesconboscombe or that we're going to get 15ft breakers" -KS

kiteman - many there are "under the illusion" -especially when they are wanting to get a "sister relationship" with malibu.

nothing wrong with that -the town is branding itself UK-europe surf central and thats ok as well.

whether its been done under an illusion or not will become apparent as time goes by and all is revealed in the outcome.

Interesting that you join in a topic then dont read a post and
"brand it" as drivel or verbal hogwash - why participate ?

I suppose if we were at a public meeting or a bar you would just be "socially unacceptable" in your behaviour so that your view might rule?
Correct me if I am wrong?

M-R

[kitesurfer]

kiteman - many there are "under the illusion" -especially when they are wanting to get a "sister relationship" with malibu.

nothing wrong with that -the town is branding itself UK-europe surf central and thats ok as well.

Interesting that you join in a topic then dont read a post and
"brand it" as drivel or verbal hogwash - why participate ?

I suppose if we were at a public meeting or a bar you would just be "socially unacceptable" in your behaviour so that your view might rule?
Correct me if I am wrong?

M-R

LOL, finally a response thats not full of the usual guff and tedium i might have even read your reply this time!

Not sure where you get your mis infomation but there is no-one in the local surfing or kitesurfing comunity that i have spoken to that believes we are going to get waves akin to pipeline.
If anyone does beleive that then good for them for being so gulable.

Malibu WTF has this got to do with the price of fish? Is it your favourite drink or something? Oh please feel free to go into some lengthy reply using lots of markety terms that once again i'll gloss over not even pretending to be interested explaining why malibu has got something to do with anything.

What do you mean branding itself the surf capital of europe? Surely you mean the world! Get your facts right! Tut tut.

Haha and if you haven't yet worked out why i'm joining in this debate then you might just be as clever as the people who believe that 15ft barrels are going to breaking at boscombe soon.

and of course you are wrong, but i don't need to go to the trouble of telling you that, mines a hobgoblin by the way if your heading to the bar sometime soon.

KS

[essex sucks]

haha lol this thread is just getting mad.

everyone i have talk to in the area when i surf there does not think its going to work the same as i don't so yeah about time this thread was put to sleep

[market-research]

a new photograph of the 'sand pile" would be nice KS?

M-R

[Jimi]

wow, seriously - M-R I don't understand how you can expect to get any valuable research here, since everyone's formed an opinion about you, and I think this opinion will influence how people respond to your questions and posts.

I suggest you should go to the reef (save up all your pennies) and talk to the local surfers there about it! Make sure you tell them you're doing market research. I'm sure they'll give you the time of day and answer all you verbose and ambiguous questions.

[RJD]

I think the plain truth is spending money on artifical reefs in places that dont get good swell in the firt place is very wastefull.

Couple that to a hideous track record of faliure and....