Leg Cramps...

[Big H]

I've been getting leg cramps lately....so bad the other day I had to call the sesh...I drink lots of water generally and prep myself for dawn patrols by drinking 1.5L water before sleeping and again when I wake up...still cramping up. I eat fairly balanced meals, don't drink, but I do drink coffee but not before surfing.

Anyone know what I can do about this, foods that might help, supplements or medications other than muscle relaxants (was thinking more along the lines of asprin).

[oldmansurfer]

I never had that problem as a youngster but do find myself having leg cramps now. I suspect that cramping is related to not only water but sodium and potassium levels in your body (maybe other elements too like magnesium and calcium). I find I need to consume salt (sodium chloride) if I am drinking lots of water or I will cramp and potassium if I am eating lots of salt. Not sure bout the other cations. A balanced diet is good but as an aging old guy I have salt (sodium chloride) and Nosalt (Potassium chloride). However bananas and lots of other foods are good sources of potassium. I am not sure why I never had a problem as a kid but I was generally very fit although skinny as a kid (and now less fit and overweight and old) ......

[drowningbitbybit]

...prep myself for dawn patrols by drinking 1.5L water before sleeping and again when I wake up...

...which might makes things worse
As OMS said, cramp is (partly) about electrolytes, and a whole load of water will unbalance that. Get some electrolyte powder or the sports drink stuff in a tub, and add that to your pre-surf water intake instead.

Aspirin etc. won't make a blind bit of difference.

[saalro]

I drink like 1.5+ litres water, eat something not unhealthy but not super healthy, something with salts and all the other goodies, i hear salt is good to stop cramp (Or i might have completely made that up.) and i also make sure i stretch well, especially the calves because this is where i usually get cramp.
I also worked out how to fight back against cramp, when i feel cramp coming, i move my foot up and down in a motion of say when you pump a foot pump, or press the accelerator pedal on a car, trying to prevent the muscle from fully tightening and causing that extreme pain, you just kind of feel it out, it worked for me last time i got cramp, but i haven't proven it since as i haven't had cramp.

[jaffa1949]

In a high sweat environment, cramps are significant , you lose minerals in the perspiration! Bali and any tropic surf zone fits this!
drinking straight water makes it worse as you are diluting any of the salts and minerals and excreting them in your urine as well. You can actually make yourself rapidly unwell by drinking too much plain water.

I find and use during my stays in the tropic, a soluble electrolyte powder dissolved in water taken at night and about an hour before a surf! Be aware that more than the dosage on the packaging is not helpful.

I know quite a few shops sell it in Kuta Supermarkets ,as with all Indo packages check the seals are intact, screw the lid uptight , it sucks up water from the humidity in the air..

Coffee, bintangs and alcohol in general causes some mineral depletion, BTW in tropic waters you still sweat so it is important!
Mad dogs and Englishmen

[dtc]

I have a different view. If you get cramps surfing but not when doing other exercise (where you sweat and deplete minerals etc just as much) then it's something specific to surfing and not the lack of minerals or electrolyes. Otherwise you would be cramping all the time. Why do you cramp surfing but not jogging or playing soccer etc?

My view is that when surfing you point your toes a lot. When paddling, when sitting out the back (during which time the water is pushing against your toes). Your might use you feet to spin the board around. Pointing your toes tenses and shortens your calf muscle, eventually causing cramp (unless you are a trained ballet dancer). You may also be tensing up your hammies by griping the board when sitting.

The solution is to be aware of the cause and keep your foot in a normal position (right angle to ankle) as much as possible, keep wriggling it around if you are sitting for a long time. Don't hold your calf muscle tensed and shortened for long periods.

Also, if you are jumping from the ground onto your board (in the shallows) then switch take off legs now and then.

So I think it's overuse of the muscle in a shortened position, not minerals etc. Now lack of water or salts or electrolytes will increase the reaction/speed of getting cramps, but (in my opinion) rarely is the cause of the cramps.

I have only personal observation to back up this conclusion, I'm not a scientist or health professional

[Big H]

Thanks all for the replies....consensus is in and I need to top up my electrolytes it seems.

There is a commercial drink available in most places; I don't care for it because of the sugars included. I am curious about the water soluable electrolyte powders....

Jaffa,
You say these powders are relatively widely available? Would they be the same powder as the sports drink that you can buy already mixed, or something else? If you had a name of a product that would be outstanding, because I'm imagining how it is going to go otherwise....

Permissi.....Salamat Siang Bu...saya cari water soluable electrolyte powder.....

[dtc]

Standard gastrolyte is an electrolyte replacement powder

[jaffa1949]

Thanks all for the replies....consensus is in and I need to top up my electrolytes it seems.

There is a commercial drink available in most places; I don't care for it because of the sugars included. I am curious about the water soluable electrolyte powders....

Jaffa,
You say these powders are relatively widely available? Would they be the same powder as the sports drink that you can buy already mixed, or something else? If you had a name of a product that would be outstanding, because I'm imagining how it is going to go otherwise....

Permissi.....Salamat Siang Bu...saya cari water soluable electrolyte powder.....

Pocari Sweat is one that can be got in lots of shops . In cans so not as effective the powder but I drink it instead of coke!

[Big H]

That's the sugary commercial drink I was referring to....

Drank a liter today before going out; didn't cramp up like I have been....

DTC has a point...in conjunction with this wave of cramping recently, I've been riding shorter boards lately and increased my water intake as well...the more twinges or actual cramps I feel in a sesh the more water I drink in advance of the next...I arch more and point my toes with my ankles crossed when paddling, keeping the feet at the water surface for less resistance in paddling around...I feel twinges when I do this and again when I'm sitting on the board and I spin on the tail doing the eggbeater kick to turn the board...so my guess is that in my particular case it is a combination of the two. I suppose I need to get more balance as far as my minerals and electrolytes (suffer through the Pocari since the alternatives here are even sweeter - Mizone and that other one I can't think of offhand), do more stretches for my hamstrings and calves, and condition my legs more....snorkeling puts them through the paces esp. since I use the long freediving fins so maybe I'll throw those in the car and look at the underside of the break on flatter days....wouldn't hurt anyway. I'm fit but I'm getting old (44)....I'll try these ideas out and report back....Thanks guys!

[jaffa1949]

Listening and hearing well there big H, finding what your exact needs are!
Dtc was right about shortened leg muscles in positioning too.
All of the above

[dtc]

Also try the chemist, they will have illness/Bali belly drinks, which are mineral/electrolyte/sodium combinations. Not sure how much sugar is in them, never looked.

You can also make up your own drinks

http://foodbabe.com/2012/07/10/the-secr ... naturally/

I actually have a tub of Gatorade powder I mix with a protein drink if it's hot. Which would be all the time in Bali I guess

[oldmansurfer]

I get leg cramps getting out of bed and surfing. Lets see.... what do these two activities have in common? In both cases I am laying down but in bed I am trying to get up and surfing It happens when I am laying down and not trying to get up. But then again I haven't been getting cramps surfing lately only getting out of bed. Hmmmmm oh well they are less severe these days. If only I spent as much time surfing as I spend in bed then I could compare them fairly.

[Big H]

So I got the big 2L bottle of Pocari Sweat with the added bonus of being square so that it doesn't roll around on my floorboards, took some healthy swigs on the way to the spot, spent 5 extra minutes on leg and calf stretches before going in. I also spent less time static on the board...if sitting in the lineup I'd get down and paddle every minute or two, even if just a few strokes, shaking my legs out in the process....spinning to get in position to catch I shifted to the tail rather than the lazy slow spin from the higher up spot I normally sit on my board....have to shift back but sitting on the tail spins quicker and my legs are closer together (narrower at the tail) which means spinning with legs rather than pointed toe feet which is what happens sitting on the fat part of the board.....when paddling I still cross my ankles and arch my legs up to keep them out of the water, but I'd alternate with full knee bending bringing my feet high up rather than always just at surface level....can't isolate one as being the reason, but I had no twinges and legs felt lively and supple throughout the sesh. Thanks for all of the advice; going to get some of the pocari powders and keep them in the glove box.

Here's a blurb copied from a randomly googled site:

What Causes Muscle Cramps in the Calves?

"Leg cramps can be caused by many conditions, ranging simply from dehydration to something much more serious such as kidney disease," said physical therapist Matthew Hyland, president of the New York Physical Therapy Association and co-owner of Rye Physical Therapy & Rehabilitation. "Cramps often result from vigorous exercise, trauma to the muscle, or keeping the leg in an awkward position for too long, such as sitting in a crowded theater. Other causes can include medications such as birth control, diuretics (which are often prescribed for people with high blood pressure) and steroids. A lack of potassium or calcium can also be the underlying cause, as well as cold weather."

How to Prevent Leg Cramps

There are a number ways you can alleviate leg cramps. "Once leg cramps set in, the best method to relieve them is movement, either walking around or simply jiggling or shaking your leg," advised Hyland. "In addition, things like pumping your ankles up and down or rubbing the muscles can help as well."

"Our musculoskeletal system hits its peak at the age of 20, and while it maintains its peak for an additional 20 years, the reality is that it begins to break down at age 40," he said. "This includes muscles becoming less flexible. Once we pass into the fourth decade of life, it is critical we play an active role in stretching and strengthening our bodies to maintain appropriate, maximal health." He added that it may be best to consult a physician if leg cramps last for 5 to 10 minutes or occur multiple times a week.

What to Take for Muscle Cramps

Analgesic balm or a patch, both sold over-the-counter at pharmacies, can provide further relief. OTC pain relief medications that are formulated to treat menstrual cramps, such a Pamprin and Midol, can be an effective treatment for bad leg cramps.

You may also be able to prevent or alleviate muscle cramps in your legs by making simple lifestyle changes. Drinking plenty of water is essential, since cramps are often caused by dehydration. A healthy diet with plenty of fresh fruits and vegetables can also help to decrease the frequency of leg cramps.


Vitamins and Minerals: Potassium and Magnesium for Muscle Cramps

Additionally, certain vitamins and minerals impact muscle function, particularly potassium and magnesium. A significant body of research has found that increasing your magnesium intake can help with the frequency of leg cramps, especially for pregnant women. Health experts recommend getting at least 300 milligrams of magnesium each day. A supplement can help you reach your daily allowance, but so can eating foods rich in magnesium, such as nuts, lentils, and quinoa.

Plan ahead for self-care if your leg cramps appear to be the result of strenuous exercise. Drink plenty of fluids and eat a well-balanced meal before heading out for a long run. Many athletes suggest eating a potassium-rich banana once you reach the finish line.

[dtc]

I think the short answer is not to get older than 20...

OMS, if you are laying on your stomach then it's back to pointing your toes

[Big H]

I think the short answer is not to get older than 20...

...tried that already....still coming to terms.....

[jaffa1949]

PISANG PORRIDGE True though

[oldmansurfer]

I point my toes surfing but maybe I do it when I am getting up out of bed. Funny the surfing cramps seem all fine but bed still gets me once in a while

[Big H]

Cold water this morning...same routine, same complete absence of cramping or pre cramp twinges. Looks like problem solved. Thanks all!

[jaffa1949]

Big H, cold for Bali yep!
down here we can get down to 13C, and to go even colder,some of our European and Nova Scotian SWers would be laughing at that We even have Swedish and Norwegian posters,
they are the ones laughing most from the blue skins.

The good news though NO cramps