Surfing Waves

I botched a head-high set wave yesterday. Dropped down, starting to do backside bottom turn, then slid out.

On reflection, I felt like I was doing a "heel slide" in the snowboarding sense, namely I was "pushing" towards shore. It seems wrong in retrospect. I felt like the correct way to do a backside bottom turn is to "heel carve" along the rail. My imagination of this motion means constant and fluid weight transition from back foot, along the rail, to front foot, fully engaging the rail --- the direction is not towards shore, but along the rail and up the wave.

Is that right?

(PS. My bottom turn can be executed on smaller than head-high waves, but this is the 2nd time that I slid out on a head-high set wave)

What center and side fins are you using? Maybe you are getting better and need a better holding fin?

When I bottom turn it is about setting the rail , getting it to catch then leaning into it.....at least that is how it appears to me. I am not sure but I might use my ankles first angling my ankles to set the rail into the wave face then lean into it. In reality there are probably a number of different ways that I set the rail. Once the rail is set then the turn loads up pressure on the fin(s) and speed is generated coming out of the turn when that pressure is released. If I want to do a tail slide I push way more on the back foot but then I never do that on a bottom turn. Is it possible you are too far forward on the board?

ConcreteVitamin wrote:(PS. My bottom turn can be executed on smaller than head-high waves, but this is the 2nd time that I slid out on a head-high set wave)

Let’s consider what variables stayed the same:
Your body, your board, your fin set up, wind and swell direction.
Now consider what variable did change: wave size.

I think in your mind you are fitting a square peg in a round hole, and not quite fitting the shape. You’re still bottom turning the same way at the same place on the wave and same time from when you popped up like you do on a smaller wave. The wave has changed. Maybe taller and more power. So you need to hold your bottom turn longer or adjust your angle of attack. Cut up too early or try to set your rail too early is like not letting the suspension on your motorcycle settle in and it bucks you off or you slide out ( which happened )
The other factor is YOU might be to anxious. Too excited that now you’re on a bigger wave and are forcing the action. Slow down and listen to what the wave is saying.

My answer seemed simpler, but...

Thanks for the technical and philosophical advice everyone. The single fin is slightly forward of center which I can set back a bit. Yes, possible that I am a touch too forward (staying sufficiently back is a drill I try to practice every session) and trying to turn at the wrong place (probably should have waited further down the wave face).

Failing to set the rail fully might be the most direct reason though. I might have tilted the tail without setting the rest of the rail line. Going to keep working on that.

Here's the best I can do so far when the stars align. As always looking for your constructive critiques!

For some reason in the video the first bottom turn seemed to have slingshotted me to the top, but my memory didn't particularly remember that feeling (although I remember to bend-knees-and-drop-down moment just afterwards)

You didn't point your toes on the dismount. What happened there anyways ? Is it super shallow right there ?

Didn’t recall any particular challenge... might be just one of those look down and go down things.

I think you just need to work on making more angular top turns which will force you to make more angular bottom turns. For me backside turns seem so much easier. I quit surfing for 12 years and restarted and right from the beginning I did much better backside. Not sure why the bottom turns were better but it took me 3 years longer to feel like my frontside bottom turns were good. I can kind of understand why the backside top turns were better because You kind of rotate your chest or at least I do when surfing backside to see where you are going. This preloads your upper body for the top turn and rotating back to facing forward off the top of the wave is much easier than looking over your shoulder on a frontside top turn

oldmansurfer wrote:I think you just need to work on making more angular top turns which will force you to make more angular bottom turns. For me backside turns seem so much easier. I quit surfing for 12 years and restarted and right from the beginning I did much better backside. Not sure why the bottom turns were better but it took me 3 years longer to feel like my frontside bottom turns were good. I can kind of understand why the backside top turns were better because You kind of rotate your chest or at least I do when surfing backside to see where you are going. This preloads your upper body for the top turn and rotating back to facing forward off the top of the wave is much easier than looking over your shoulder on a frontside top turn

Got it. More angular. Speaking of which I have a concrete question. When initiating the first bottom turn, am I deep enough in the trough? From the video it seems the trough is still a touch farther down the wave face. When on the wave it's kind of hard to convince my body to keep going down to what looks to be the flats.

There is not any real hard fast wrong or right about riding a wave. It's what you want to do. The old Hawaiians said that surfing was simply the act of accompanying the wave toward the shore. Everything else you do is up to you. Use a board? Any board..... no board....turn...go straight....do airs....it's all surfing. It's up to you to figure out how you are going to do that. But my guess is you need to work on your bottom turn. I can't see the wave well enough to tell how low on the wave you are but how low you go depends on the wave. The really steep waves require you go to the flats to bottom turn but mostly you initiate the turn before the absolute flat bottom of the wave although you will go there through the turn What you don't want to do is ride out into the flat portion of the wave and loose speed. If you do that it limits what you can do after. You want to maintain speed because you then have more options to choose from. You also need to be able to read the wave and know what will be required. I think most surfers learn in small increments turn a little harder on the bottom turn a little harder on the top and trying to judge what the wave is doing. Eventually you will gain an assortment of maneuvers you can do and know when to do them . For me and most surfers learning to make good bottom turns is the single most important wave riding skill to have. The bottom turn sets up what you can do next which sets up what you can do next which sets up what you can do next .....

ConcreteVitamin wrote:Didn’t recall any particular challenge....

The “challenge” is to complete the ride. To finish cleanly standing on your feet. To be in control from take off to kick out.

If you want to learn how to transition your weight back during the bottom turn, learn to kick out each and ever time the wave is about to end. It will teach you to be mindful of what’s ahead. To be able to step back and engage the tail/rail.

** and use your front hand for more than recover/counterbalance. Right now you’re all back hand. Lead the shoulder with the front hand.

Gotta ask again, what kind and size vente fin and what size side fins? I use a 9.5 cutaway with GX side fins on my big longboard days, and switch to single fins on small days. Used to use a raking fin when I was in my nose riding phase.

What’s your ser up?

ConcreteVitamin wrote: I felt like I was doing a "heel slide" in the snowboarding sense

When I do a heel slide on a skateboard my weight is over the nose while I push the tail downhill. Are you doing this in the water? When I do a bottom turn in the ocean my weight is over the fin and the inside rail.

IB_Surfer wrote:Gotta ask again, what kind and size vente fin and what size side fins? I use a 9.5 cutaway with GX side fins on my big longboard days, and switch to single fins on small days. Used to use a raking fin when I was in my nose riding phase.

What’s your ser up?

8" 4A on 7'4 board. I've moved it around in 1/4" increments and most recently about 3/8" behind center of the box. At this placement, still felt squirrelly on a recent overhead drop.

Guessing either keep moving it back in 1/4" increments until I feel secure on solid days, or just give up and put in side bites (have a smaller 7.5" center fin to use with 3.25" side bites - my previous experience on it were on fun size waves, not head high+, and. felt a bit sticky but secure).

Re: Boman, weight too forward could totally be a factor that I'm working on improving.

ConcreteVitamin wrote:

IB_Surfer wrote:Gotta ask again, what kind and size vente fin and what size side fins? I use a 9.5 cutaway with GX side fins on my big longboard days, and switch to single fins on small days. Used to use a raking fin when I was in my nose riding phase.

What’s your ser up?

8" 4A on 7'4 board. I've moved it around in 1/4" increments and most recently about 3/8" behind center of the box. At this placement, still felt squirrelly on a recent overhead drop.

Guessing either keep moving it back in 1/4" increments until I feel secure on solid days, or just give up and put in side bites (have a smaller 7.5" center fin to use with 3.25" side bites - my previous experience on it were on fun size waves, not head high+, and. felt a bit sticky but secure).

Re: Boman, weight too forward could totally be a factor that I'm working on improving.

The Greenough 4A is supposed to be one of the best for a single fin setup. I read that it's recommended for most retro single fin shortboards too. I think i'll probably go through similar adjustments with positioning, but from what I've read, it's one of the ideal fins once you get the positioning fine tuned. Best of luck with it