ACL tear + cut backs and other stuff

[OlegLupusov]

Has anybody tried surfing at higher level than advanced beginner with acl tear or other knee issues.

Simple down the lines are fine but more sophisticated things like cutbacks and board walking turn out to be challenging and impact the knee.

Are there any ways to handle this problem besides surgery?

[jaffa1949]

If you do sports based where performance is based on translating force and torque through the knee , there is a progressive answer.
Is the tear partial,or full ? A guess of diagnosis by you or by a sports doctor?

Now the verdict, part tears if left can thickennand become stronger if left to,accurately heal,with a proper physio program. Dependent on where the tear is. ( risk factor in surfing , an injury resulting in full,tear and possible greater damage beyond that)

If the tear is a full one already , full dislocation of the knee is possible damaging other tissue and structures within the joint.

Knowing the Russian system of destruction to surfboards, I would recommend seeking medical advice over anything an Internet forum can offer.
Understand fully the level of what you have and then make the informed decision. Solar resin won't fix it!

[oldmansurfer]

I have some kind of most likely ligament problem in my knee. I hurt it making a sharp turn while playing with my dog. It hasn't ever been properly diagnosed but initially I had Xrays done and they did not see anything which is what they usually see if you have an ACL tear. They need MRI to make a diagnosis. I restarted surfing after this injury and it very likely is a result of me getting out of shape due to not surfing. I ice my knee every time I feel any twinge of anything and that seems to keep it mostly pain free. Back when I restarted surfing my knee would bother me surfing and at one point I thought I would have to quit again but I started hiking on flat ground, a road basically that has a steep incline but nice and flat so as to be minimally jarring to my knee. I did toe raises where I stand flat footed and raise one foot off the ground then stand on my toes on the other foot. I also combine this with curling a 15 pound dumbbell on the same side I am standing on my toes. I do half squats so that it doesn't make my knee worse so not going more than making my upper leg parallel to the ground. Those exercises seem to have strengthened my knees but for instance recently I was surfing in shallow sand bottom and dismounted once by stepping off my board. This made my knee feel a little discomfort after I came in from surfing. Just a little annoying twinge but I iced it down and it feels better. I am however very in tune with what hurts me or makes me better so I through a process of trying a lot of different things have come up with this set of exercises that seems to work for me. Whatever you do don't do it if it makes you worse. Also initially I iced my knee down after every time I exercised. At this point I no longer need to do that. I also iced my knee too much and got a mild case of frostbite so ice your knee for 20 minutes and not more. But if it is really sore 20 minutes on 20 minutes off and 20 minutes on again seemed to work for me. Seeing a doctor is good advice but while I did see one none of what I do was recommended by him. He said take Ibuprofen which is like totally the last resort for me which means I never take it for my knee.

[oldmansurfer]

The maneuver that I most worry about is a hard backside bottom turn on a big fast choppy wave. I can feel the jarring tension in my knees but so far so good. The maneuver that hurts my knee most is jumping off my board in shallow water. Yeah I know......it should be easy to avoid right? I guess its' only after the fact that I consider the consequences. Maybe someday I will quit doing that.

[Tudeo]

I also have a bad knee I keep under control by icing (20-30min) after every surf or yoga session. Also before surfing I do a slow and long warming up for the knee.
I never feel any pain during surfing (because of the adrenaline rush maybe?), but the discomfort is always there after doing sports. I'm pretty sure I'm still surfing thanks to the icing routine.

[jaffa1949]

Let's clear up a little , the ligaments either side of the knee are the co-lateral ligaments of which the ones on the inner side of the knees are the medials they stabilise the knee in side to side movement, the medial can also pull the medial meniscus into a position where it can be damaged in extreme movement and leave fragments in the joint space, not nice.
The Cruciate Ligaments the anterior and posterior stabilise the knee in front to back movement , you most often hear of them being ruptured in footballers or high performance surfers.

Yoga, fitness , pilates , stretching and a whole range physical therapy can help but the dynamic nature of surf means even a perfect knee can be caught short.
Building up the balancing and structural muscle around the knee can be a great help, the more balanced the muscle groups around any joint the better.
In any clinical situation I would also look at how the injury first occurred. this would point out any deficiency of technique or unbalanced muscle strength. Without correcting these it can happen again. A tear on a tear is worse , a rupture worse still.
Go get thoroughly diagnosed.

[RinkyDink]

You might want to look into a compression sleeve for your knee. Some people swear by compression type braces and I've heard others claim they're detrimental. I do think they use them in professional sports, but I can't remember the last time I saw professional wearing a knee sleeve. I don't know about how well they work, but I would look into it. Along the same lines, there is also kinesiology tape. Again, I don't know enough about it to give you reliable information. However, I've just started my fifth month of weight training three times a week in my garage and the most important thing I've learned at this stage is not to judge the merit of my workout by how I feel. In other words, "no pain, no gain" is BS for me. I judge my progress by the increases in weight that I can lift with good form. If I'm completely wrecked after a workout that doesn't mean the workout was good. In fact, I try not to overly stress my body. I do, however, make incremental increases in the weight I lift. So far I'm injury free and getting stronger every week. It took me a few injuries and backsliding to finally learn that lesson. Anyway, if you decide to try some exercises to strengthen your knee, I would recommend the slow and steady approach.

[benjl]

Try and archillies rupture and then see you in a year

But seriously, get it properly checked out or you'll be more knocked off your feet than klitchko

[jaffa1949]

Comment on knee and compression braces.... only if you have real need. You can get habituation to their support without the anatomical structure underneath being sound. If the support is forgotten or the impact of a wave is greater, so is the resulting injury.

A lot of the tips that are being given are appropriate for minor sprains and strains, not for a tear.
A partial tear is recommended about 12 weeks out of the water with structured rehab exercises and muscle balancing and most likely strengthening work. Full tear surgery and reattachment with luck via keyhole surgery.

One more thing to consider, a long term structurally unbalance knee will lead to excessive cartilage and bony wear and tear, one of the major causes of osteoarthritis and lthe need in later life of possible knee replacement . Lower limb joints malfunction causes wear and tear elsewhere, so think wear. You wouldn't drive a car with unbalanced steering or tyres why would you do that to your body ( worth more than any car)

Tom Carroll has had to have a full knee replacement after years of interventions and clean outs. Links to the article by his brother Nick Carroll in Coastalwatch
http://www.coastalwatch.com/surfing/214 ... mmy-s-knee

[OlegLupusov]

Full tear confirmed by doctors and MRI.
Wetsuit itself is a sort of a brace stabilizing a knee. But that is not enough for more advanced moves. Regular down the line is fine even in bigger waves. I cannot do boxing anymore. However, tennis with girls and not that aggressive players could be doable.

Has anybody tried braces while surfing? Do they survive interaction with ocean water? Do you mean primitive "under 100 dollar" braces or 1000 dollar braces?
Does anybody have first hand experience of the kind?

[oldmansurfer]

A completely torn ACL is more than what I have. Maybe you should ask you doctor about it? Saltwater corrodes everything so it would need to be plastic or carbon fiber or high grade stainless steel or.......... You can go surf in the great lakes USA. I am sure even the best stainless will still rust in saltwater eventually. Maybe if you can modify one to attach pieces of magnesium to the steel and that would preferentially rust before the steel will. I had a friend who skied with a ruptured ACL and a brace, and that seemed to work unless he forgot the brace. Sorry no experience with that. I haven't ever seen a surfer with a knee brace too. Forget all that I just googled it and there are knee braces made for surfing