Still in poo stance?

[Big H]

If that is your local, you should make it a goal to be able to ride those waves....maybe not perfect, but those are decent and eminently rideable.....a little dead section in the middle you could paddle up then around the break to get out back or jump thru the beach break and go straight up the gut since those faces are holding up and not breaking all the way into the beach. On that 7'9" you need waves like that to feel what a turn is....what you were doing isn't surfing or turning....trimming a little in waist deep slop is what it is at best....that is the wave that you take on your belly after finishing a ride and wanting to get to the beach, not one a surfer who is 4 years in should consider as a ride.

I took an introductory lesson and half the class was doing what you are doing in this video after 20min. You really have to push yourself harder; I KNOW you have the stoke, you think about this stuff and get out there to practice, but unless you practice all aspects of surfing, especially the unsung parts like reading the break, choosing the peaks that will work, figuring ways out back with big or small boards, having the stamina to get out there repeatedly, keep it on idle to hold position, then juice it to catch waves....unless you work HARD on those things you won't achieve your surfing goals (at least the goals that you've spoken about....turning, pumping down the line, etc). After you get that ability to get out back on a rideable day like in that video, paddle power and positioning guile to catch waves easily, THEN you should start to worry about feeling turns.

Don't settle for that waist deep stuff.....you're well past that....go battle those waves and force your way out back about a 1000 times; you'll build that stamina and figure out ways and timing. Then get on those tasty waves and figure out how to ride them.

[Big H]

Please don't take it the wrong way......like I said I can feel your stoke....the videos, the threads, the conversations....you're INTO it; love that!

....but you have to push yourself and get out of that waist deep day one beginner zone that you're playing in if you ever really want to effect any change......get out there and get after it!

[RinkyDink]

By the way, have you tried the 360 move yet? Try it. Write 360 on your board so you remember. One of the other things I notice in your vids is that you're sort of bobbing up and down. It's hard to tell what you're doing, I think you might be leaning forward and back. Anyway, I suggest you start thinking more about twisting your torso. Put a helmet and some skate pads on and try doing a 360 on your skateboard going clockwise and counter-clockwise. That's the motion you need to start getting an intuitive sense of. Have fun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRYJ-3WD6Eg

[RinkyDink]

I just need that good day, or a point break

I hear that. Getting the right waves makes learning a hell of a lot easier.

[pmcaero]

Put a helmet and some skate pads on and try doing a 360 on your skateboard going clockwise and counter-clockwise.

I really want to do this on my surf skateboard. I have to remember to end my rides that way when I surf too

[pmcaero]

I took an introductory lesson and half the class was doing what you are doing in this video after 20min.

But see, that's the thing. I never took a lesson, never had someone drill me in turns. I should have watched more videos in the beginning,to not start doing it wrong in the first place. Even being in the whitewater and focusing on turning with my arms leading and my back foot is new to me.

[pmcaero]

Today was clean but small and windy. Here's an example of a ride. I feel like my frontside turns are delayed and awkward. Maybe the wind blowing South, therefore against me when I go turn frontside had something to do with this? Not sure.

http://i.imgur.com/CCORs63.gifv

[Big H]

Yeah....like I said, I don't want to harsh on your stoke......

....its a hard thing to figure, learning to surf on your own.....I know; been there......but I've got a lot of superstar examples to emulate in front of me every time I go out (Indonesian teenagers)...alot of guys here recommended getting an instructor, at least a lesson here and there.....I'm considering it; can't see how it would hurt......in my development I had a big period of frustration where I just couldn't catch waves either....went for a few months on my longboard where a good sesh was 5 waves in 2 hours.....pearled about a 1000 times and paddled forever.....then I sorted out how to catch waves on purpose (:lol:) and a whole new surfing world opened up.......

....here's the rub.....as a newbie I went to crap beaches or good beaches and stayed well away from the other surfers since I really didn't know my a.. from my elbow....and I had a lot of trouble catching waves........found out later when I sorted how to catch them that I'd been torturing myself on waves that no one else wanted to ride because they really weren't surfable waves for one reason or another.....I finally went to a beach with decent waves, went to the line up and BINGO, a whole world opened up.....I kicked myself for all those hours spent tooling around the breaks that were lonely and empty (FOR A REASON).

Moral of the story; you need decent waves to surf. With decent waves you can progress your surfing.

BTW, that intro lesson that we had that we were doing that....the instructor said "paddle!" and I did....then he yelled "stand up" and I poo stance did.....then he yelled "look right" and I did and the board turned right......when I later tried to catch a wave that wasn't whitewater I didn't get that -bang- in the back to push me into the wave.....found out later when I read up on it that catching whitewater and catching "green waves" (there's a newb term for ya!) were two very different things in that the green waves needed positioning, timing and a smoother, faster pop up as well as a much more effective and better timed paddle than I'd have for months.

FWIW, I got the feel for surfing off the back foot and making turns by using a longboard and learning to turn that....you gotta stomp on it and it's startling when you first start doing it how much of the board sticks out of the water ....no more tooling around like a canoe, get that nose up and you're SURFING!.................you have a 7'9", you need to learn to make turns at speed where the nose of the board sticks out of the water and stays sticking out of the water....of course you can't look down at it though, as soon as you do that nose is going to slap down flat and you're on the front foot and hunched over again.

Honestly, W-chan gave you the best advice (as it should be....listen to the surf instructor!).....forget turns, forget pumping....go take that 7'9" board out back, learn to catch those waves at their peak and slide down them straight, then learn to angle a bit and start going down the line and keep doing that and keep enjoying that.....get so that you can do that and do it well without washing off speed front and backside....that will take you awhile (year or two at least I reckon) and is plenty to work on/aspire to considering all the collateral things that are going to have to be developed to achieve that seemingly simple goal (paddle fitness and technique, positioning, pushing back the mental block of learning to ride bigger waves, more paddle fitness, etc).

Good luck!

[drowningbitbybit]

YOUR ARMS!!! WHAT ARE YOU DOING WITH YOUR ARMS?!?!?!?!

On a little wave like that you need to be driving forward before you can even think about doing a turn. Your front arm should have been way out in front of you and you should be leaning forward like you're trying to reach something in front of you. Your trailing arm should be behind you to start, and then come in front of you to conserve momentum and increase drive as you hit the flats - then you'll have some speed and you can turn your head, shoulders and your arms into the turn to get back onto the face.

...And then there's the legs. Don't crouch down so far straight away - crouch as you drop down the wave to increase the energy of the drop, then you can extend and turn at the bottom when you've got maximum speed.

At the moment, with your arms hanging down like that and a static poo stance, you're borderline stalling the board and you're just along for the ride - the board needs to be pushed by the wave and the rider.

You'll get there

[pmcaero]

YOUR ARMS!!! WHAT ARE YOU DOING WITH YOUR ARMS?!?!?!?!

Any tips on how to remember proper arm placement? For the first time I am focusing on adjusting so many things in my body positioning and board control that every ride I forget one or another

[pmcaero]

Honestly, W-chan gave you the best advice (as it should be....listen to the surf instructor!).....forget turns, forget pumping....go take that 7'9" board out back, learn to catch those waves at their peak and slide down them straight, then learn to angle a bit and start going down the line and keep doing that and keep enjoying that.....

But how can I go down the line without a bottom turn? I can angle my take-off and angle the pop up, but eventually the board still goes in the flats without some sort of change of direction to stay higher on the face.

[waikikikichan]

Who said you need to " stay high on the face " ? Granted there isn't even a face on the mushy white water you've been riding. You need to get out to the "green waves" and angle a bit away from the curl, stand up and do nothing but roll down the street. Sure you're going to get munched sometimes. But as time goes on you realize position and timing, then you'll start being in the clear.

[drowningbitbybit]

Any tips on how to remember proper arm placement? For the first time I am focusing on adjusting so many things in my body positioning and board control that every ride I forget one or another

Simplify things. Just go along the line as Wkkchan says. And point where you want to go - for now, forget about what your feet/knees/shoulders/everything are doing... just go with it. Look where you want to go... reach out with your leading hand to where you want to go and the rest will follow.

Imagine there's always something just in front of the board that you're trying to reach - that's going along the line. Now it's going up and down the face, so you reach up and then you reach down - that's pumping. Then imagine it has stopped, and you have to reach down and behind you to pick it up - that's turning.

But whatever you're doing - you're always looking where you want to go, and you're always trying to reach it.

[RinkyDink]

But how can I go down the line without a bottom turn?

Think about it this way. If you tried to turn a 900 pound motorcycle from a complete stop, with the bike limited to a top speed of 1 mile per hour and your feet off the ground and on the foot pedals, then you'd probably have a hard time pulling that off. I would say that you're not going to be able to do a bottom turn on those mushy waves because they don't have enough power. So I think you'll just have to wait until your beach gives you favorable surfing conditions. When a good 2-4 foot day comes along, be ready to try some takeoffs on steeper, faster waves. Your popup is adequate-check. You can stand up and ride your board-check. Now you just need to start practicing taking off on a steeper incline. If worse comes to worse, fork out $100 for a private lesson with an instructor and get help. Try to line up your lesson with the right surf conditions.

[RinkyDink]

Speaking of taking off on steeper waves, when I started working on my takeoffs on bigger faces one of the problems I had was releasing my death grip on the rail of my board. I would be moving so fast down the face of the wave that when I released my grip my hand would get pulled in the water like a paddle and throw me off balance. That was one of the problems I had to solve and maybe gives you an idea of the kind of speed you want to start getting.

[dtc]

You're a brave man to keep exposing yourself!

I think your issue remains that you are bending too much at the waist and shoving your head out, which means your feet are pushing the board away, weight is more over the balls of your feet and your arms are waving around trying to compensate. Look at your avatar - your head is almost over the edge of the board (and you are leaning backwards in that photo).

Your head should (when you are going straight) be centred over the centre of the board. And bending your knees in really helps to achieve this - if you dont bend your knees in, it all falls apart as well. Anyway, you are bending too much at the waist. Practice at home, see how you can get a low stance that is comfortable

have a read here of the principles (if that helps) http://www.surfscience.com/topics/surfi ... f-surfing/

As DBB says, when you want to turn point your finger where you want to go. It feels really weird, you probably think it looks really weird. But it works (obviously point with your arm and shoulder - dont just point your arm across your body). Point, look down your arm at where you are pointing and voila.

YOUR ARMS!!! WHAT ARE YOU DOING WITH YOUR ARMS?!?!?!?!

Any tips on how to remember proper arm placement? For the first time I am focusing on adjusting so many things in my body positioning and board control that every ride I forget one or another

Its 'easy'....arms stay on the same side of the board as they were before you popped up. Front arm goes out front (but slightly behind your body ie same side of the board as before you popped up), back arm goes out back (but slightly in front of your body). This is the starting point.

You have been given lots of tips, you are trying to remember them all. Its hard - but I still feel, in my opinion, that your problems all come from having an unbalanced stance. You spend the rest of your time trying to fix it. Head over the centre of the board!

Your wave catching and pop up looked pretty good!

[pmcaero]

Your head should (when you are going straight) be centred over the centre of the board. And bending your knees in really helps to achieve this - if you dont bend your knees in, it all falls apart as well. Anyway, you are bending too much at the waist. Practice at home, see how you can get a low stance that is comfortable

You have been given lots of tips, you are trying to remember them all. Its hard - but I still feel, in my opinion, that your problems all come from having an unbalanced stance. You spend the rest of your time trying to fix it. Head over the centre of the board!
!

Thanks!
I think the knees are one problem. I practice at home and on the skateboard but it's gets a bit painful after a while. Dunno if it's age (35) or simply not having played any sports as a teen.
So I guess my body doesn't naturally get in that stance when surfing, unless I really think about it, and there are so many other things to think about.

[pmcaero]

You need to get out to the "green waves" and angle a bit away from the curl, stand up and do nothing but roll down the street.

I've done this before, on good days. I've had nice long rides.
Problem is on a good day it gets fairly crowded, and I tend to lose focus around crowds and miss waves.
Also, on a big day I just can't seem to get this Bic board out past the impact zone, and when I finally do I am too pooped to even try to catch waves, so I end up going back and playing in the white water. I try to identify channels and outflow but it's a beach break, never managed to find such.
The shortboard made it easier to get out but then I would end up sharing waves with five or ten other people who knew what they were doing.
And so I decided to get good enough to be able to go out there with them and , maybe it's psychological, but I would feel more entitled to paddle for waves if I were confident that once on a wave, I would be able to control my board.

[Big H]

Hahahha.....you aren't old enough to start to blame age! Esp. not here with all the active geezers like me around!

Seriously though, address that. Do some stretches, sit indian style, sit kneeling with your feet under you on the sofa when you're watching tv...squat like Indonesians do....

Do some squats without weights every morning....25 a day for a few weeks....step it up to 50 or 100. This can be one of the indirect aspects of surfing that can really provide physical benefits for you and slow that ageing process....35 is way too young to give up and start blaming time.

[pmcaero]

Thanks for the encouragement. I used to think I was flexible till I tried to emulate a proper surfing stance
I did a bit of Tae-Kwon-Do in my mid 20s and was at least as flexible as anyone there. But bringing the knees close together while lowering myself always takes active thought. I started doing squats recently for this very purpose. Maybe I should do a few right before I go in the water. 6mm wetsuit doesn't help either