Popup advice

[maggersmagoo]

Hello all. I've been following this forum for a few months. I just got a mount for my GoPro, so I thought I'd post a couple videos and see if anyone has specific advice for my popup. I've been at this for about four months. Went out every weekend in the beginning, a little less frequently now with the busy holidays and such this time of year.

The first two I thought were my best of the day. My feet landed close to where I wanted them to. Most of them were like the third one, where my foot landed far outside and needed to be moved to the center. I was able to get away with it mostly because I was in fairly small and slow whitewash. I'd like to correct that before I get back out to the line up. I'd also like to get much faster.

I also see myself looking down just as I'm popping up. I'd like to get to where I keep my head up and look down the line as I pop up.

I plan to keep practicing pop ups at home, and of course in the water whenever I can. Anyone have more specific advice?

[Big H]

Practice popping up at home while looking at a corner of the room as if you were going down the line....learn to feel the board under your feet and adjust without looking down (several hundred hours in water time from now)....and as simply silly as it sounds, DON'T look down, ever. Keep your eyes and chin up and your body will be in better form......last bit is that on waves or whitewater like you're riding, the board doesn't fall away at all so all the effort to make the space between the board and your body lies in you; you don't get any dynamic help from a steeper wave face....that being said, it has been said before here by WKK, you need to EXPLODE off the deck, not climb up like you are....get 50 pushups a day in your life and before you know it you'll have the tone to explode up and make the space needed to get up clean.

[kookextraordinaire]

I remember reading a post a long time ago by you, Big H, which helped the problem of looking immeasurably. You said “stick out your chin and point it to where you want to go”.

Keep that in mind, mergersmagoo, when you are looking at at a corner in your room. There is a HUGE difference between looking with your eyes and turning your head. It will improve your form in the future. You can even do it when paddling for a wave. It was a huge breakthrough for me. Thanks, Big H!

+1 on the pushups.

[oldmansurfer]

I am not a surf instructor but you look like you are doing fine to me. I think what would help is spending more time surfing and riding some bigger waves. You can practice your popup at home but it's not quite the same as on your board surfing but it's probably better to practice at home than to not practice and pretend you are surfing so instead of just going through the motions try to imagine you are on a wave and doing it and don't look down until you cut out. You need to challenge yourself. Set goals and pass them but most importantly have fun

[billie_morini]

maggsmagoo,
love your videos. I'm an old guy and still meet modern technology with amazement. Anyway, the best advice I can offer is that you do this exercise on land and lots of them: squat thrust (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burpee_(exercise)). It'll really help you when you get to unbroken waves and get to ride many of them.
billie

[RinkyDink]

My advice for land popups is to look where you want to go as well as look at your feet. Don't look down at your feet while you're popping up in the surf, but if you're in a garage look at the way your feet are landing on the board. Put a mirror in front of you, if you're really into it, and get the way your feet land on the board locked into your muscle memory. Once you have a good sense of how your landing feels, start looking where you want to go on your popup and check your foot positioning after you've popped up into your default stance. I'd also learn to pop up without grabbing your rails; push yourself up off the deck of your board rather than gripping the rails. It looks like you already do that. I had to teach myself that by practicing it.

[dtc]

You arent popping up, you are standing up

What I mean is that you bring your back foot up, and then your front foot sort of wanders along as an afterthought. Your hips are out of alignment. You arent lifting your hips and pulling your legs through explosively. You are taking a step with your back foot but you dont turn your hips, so your front leg cant get through

The pop is explosive. Its not 3 or 5 moves, its pretty much one move where everything happens. It seems impossible when you start, but i guarantee once it clicks you will rarely think about your pop up again.

These are from your 3rd video but its consistent with the others

to start, you step off your back foot, your front foot is way behind. This could be ok although slow (google 'aussie sprinter' pop up). Its not ideal, only works on longboards (where you have board to step off). You 'should' (in the classic pop up) have a strong arm push (with your arms further back towards your hips), your hips come up and your legs both swing through more or less at the same time. However, the aussie sprinter method is ok.

1.JPG (14.07 KiB) Viewed 1920 times

However, then your hands are still down and your hips are still square to the board. think about the body position - its impossible to get your front foot to be in line with your back foot if your hips are square (try it at home - you just cant do it and retain any sort of balance). This is where your pop up starts to break down - your hips need to be turning, need to be side on. Also your weight is a bit all over the place - half on your hands and half on your back foot; its not a great position to create stability when you have to stand up

2.JPG (12.91 KiB) Viewed 1920 times

now your hips are still pretty square on, your front foot just lands over to the side because it just cant go anywhere else. Your hips arent aligned and, in fact, your arms is still in the way of your foot. Your hands are still down, you should have your front foot planted and eyes up and hands up by now

3.JPG (15.35 KiB) Viewed 1920 times

Basically you need to move faster, explode more and twist those hips!

[maggersmagoo]

Thank you so much for all the replies! I definitely have a lot to work on, but I think this should be my immediate focus:

1. Pushups, squat thrusts, etc. for fitness and power. I really have no excuse not to be doing this, as we are allotted time at work for working out. Just need to drag my butt to the gym.

2. Slide my hands down closer to my hips, and focus on twisting my hips as I'm rising. That should solve the problem of my foot landing in the wrong place.

3. Work on turning my chin/head as I'm popping up. I have this third because I realize it's important, but I also feel it will come more naturally as I get 1 and 2 squared away.

I really appreciate the still frame breakdown of what I'm doing. Does anyone happen to have a similar breakdown of a proper popup? That would be SO helpful. I've watched videos on Youtube over and over, but it's hard for me to mentally break down what is happening because it is one fast fluid movement. If I could see it in super slow mo or still frame I think I could translate it better to what my body should be doing.

Oldman, thanks for the encouragement. I definitely don't want to overthink everything, and I think if I get back to paddling out to the lineup and catching waves, some of this will come naturally. For 2 or 3 sessions before I made this video, I had gone out the the lineup, and actually caught a few waves. I ended up popping up too late on all of them, as I was intimidated by the increased speed of the takeoff (compared to whitewash), so by the time I got up I was in front of the waves and they knocked me over. I wanted to spend a day going back to basics and seeing what I'm doing with the camera. Also it was windy and messy, and the waves were a hair bigger than I'm comfortable with at this stage.

Bottom line, I'm still having a blast, and have not once regretted going out, no matter how poorly it seemed to go, or how much I get my butt kicked. I feel like every time I go out I learn something. As ugly as my popup may be, I'm pleased as punch to be where I'm at. Every other time I have tried surfing, I couldn't get past going to one knee first. I feel like I'm already more efficient than that, and it will easier to improve from this point than from one knee.

I hope to have more videos to post soon, next time from the lineup. The water has gotten miserably cold (by my standards), but I ordered some warmer booties, and I'm determined to suffer through it to get where I want to be. I'm moving to Oahu next summer, and my goal is to be actually catching waves by the time I get there. The warm water will be such a treat!

Thanks again!

[dtc]

For some shots here is the aussie sprinter method ie where you push off your toes

all 'right way' shots are from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XoH8xWlPNeg


The two keys are: 1. the back foot lands with toes pointing at 3pm NOT straight and 2. weight goes immediately onto the back foot then front foot/equal and NOT kept on the hands (note - doing the death grip on the board is a fairly common beginners issue because holding the board creates stability and your brain is saying 'wtf are you trying to do jumping up onto this unstable platform'. You have to override your brain and accept that the board is stable enough to stand on.). Its literally like a sprint start in running, except your back foot lands side on (toes at 3 o'clock) and then you stand up and your body and hips and front foot should following around naturally because your back foot is twisted.

So step 1 - right way at top and you. Pretty much you are ok, except your back foot isnt turned far enough to 3 oclock. I also suggest you move your hands back down toward your hips at least 6 inches

1.JPG (14.07 KiB) Viewed 1894 times

Step 2 - this is where your pop up breaks down. the 'right way' shows that at this stage hands are off the board, weight is on the back foot, hips are turning. You are still clutching at the board, weight is over your hands, hips are straight, head is totally in the wrong place

2.JPG (12.91 KiB) Viewed 1894 times

Step 3 - as a result of step 2, you can see the difference. You should be up, standing, looking at where you want to go - you are still down, clutching the board, feet in the wrong place etc

3.JPG (15.35 KiB) Viewed 1894 times

[dtc]

And here are some 'proper' pop up shots - its a much quicker process

First push up the hips and chest and start swinging both legs through at the same time

hands come up as feet come through and hips twist to land feet properly (back foot at 3, front foot at about 1 oclock) - although his hands are touching the board still, there is very little weight on the hands.

pop up 2.1.JPG (25.23 KiB) Viewed 1894 times

then you are carving! This shot isnt the absolute end of the pop up - his back knee will come up to weight the back foot in about a milli second

pop up 3.1.JPG (27.05 KiB) Viewed 1894 times

[dtc]

Finally - I think your main problem is that you want the pop up to be a slow controlled event where you are always 'balanced' and have a good grip on the board. This is common for beginners - they want surfing to be done slowly and in a measured fashion while they figure out what is going on

But its a fast explosive movement and there is a very short period where you barely have any contact with the board or weighting on the board. Just trust that your feet will land and the board will be there!

Its like riding a bike in a way - if you ride slowly to get your balance and so forth, its actually much harder than if you are riding faster.

[kookextraordinaire]

That guy's back foot is a couple of feet away from the fins. One can't turn a mini-mal from the middle. A great example of explosiveness; foot placement not so much. No way is that guy going to be able to turn his board.

I firmly believe that, even though hands back by the hips is easier, the hands should be under the armpits/chest area. It's the only way to ensure a wide enough stance and proper foot positioning. (mid lengths and longboards excluded from this).

In this video, Reynolds does multiple pop-ups. If you watch closely his hands are NEVER down by his hips.

He pushes down on the board with hands at chest level (he doesn't push his body up and away)l, and his front foot roughly replaces where his hands are.

It may be easier to have your hands further down, but, as evidenced above, it's bad technique, and results in "ballerina stance". Repetition quickly becomes a bad habit. If you can't pop up with your hands at chest/armpit level, get stronger. It will be harder at first, but surfing isn't easy. In the long run you will be a better surfer.

So, to re-iterate, it's very simple:

Hands at chest/armpit level
Push down hard on the board (don't push your body up and away)
Front foot roughly replaces where hands were
Back foot will naturally go over the fins



To re-iterate, longboards and mid-length eggy shapes are excluded from this rant.

[dtc]

Well, firstly the guy in the pics/video is doing pop ups on land, so criticising him for foot placement is a bit moot as I dont think that was his aim. Also, most people who ask for advice on the pop up are not surfing shortboards.

Pop ups do not require much strength, beyond a minimum. 'Getting stronger' wont help if you have that minimum. I've surfed with rugby players who could literally throw you across the room and the pop up isnt any easier for them than for your average desk jockey. As you say, on waves the board falls away from you.

Your front foot doesnt land where your hands are. Your front foot lands where your front shoulder was - your shoulder goes up and twists but basically stays on the same vertical line (it might go very slightly back). Your hips fall under your shoulder because that is how your body is built and your front foot is connected to the hip. Your hands can be superman forward or hanging around your hips and your foot will end up in the same place if your push is correct (ie straight up).

Anyway, generally i suggest front hand (hand matching your front foot) at chest level and back foot hand at belly button level. It probably doesnt work for 5'8 HPSBs, but it works for most people. But whatever works works!

You can see Dane R has his hands at lower chest level. His inside hand (back foot hand) is slightly behind

dr 2.JPG (20.75 KiB) Viewed 1882 times

[oldmansurfer]

In this video, Reynolds does multiple pop-ups. If you watch closely his hands are NEVER down by his hips.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0zPiS2_qJg

He pushes down on the board with hands at chest level (he doesn't push his body up and away)l, and his front foot roughly replaces where his hands are.
.

I don't think you can see enough of his popup to say what he does. None of that shows him paddling for a wave. I think the more forward your hands are the more forward you will popup both front and rear feet. If I want to get my board quickly down a wave I will popup forward so my weight is immediately pushing the board down the wave. My front foot will be forward but so will my rear foot. I then have to move back to do sharp turns. But maybe it's just me as I am aware perhaps my skill set is different than everyone else.

[oldmansurfer]

By the way he has a nice shot of him doing repeated speed turns as he passes by a surfer who dropped in on him at the end of that video. Also watch his rear foot position it is often forward of the traction pad.

[maggersmagoo]

Its like riding a bike in a way - if you ride slowly to get your balance and so forth, its actually much harder than if you are riding faster.

Thanks for the breakdown, and I really like this analogy. Unfortunately, in surfing there are no training wheels, or parents to hold the board steady while you figure things out.

[Oldie]

My popup find the pop up much easier when the hands are at the lower chest, somewhere at the end of the ripcage, but not lower. I see a huge difference vs having them under the upper chest. I am no shortboarder and pretty tall, so it still results in wide enough stance.

The Aussie Sprinter method looks nice, but I lose too much time with it.