Participation Trophies and Soup riding

[waikikikichan]

There's a big debate about Participation Trophies ( look up NFL pro linebacker James Harrison and why he returned his kid's trophies ).
He said " I came home to find out that my boys received two trophies for nothing, participation trophies! While I am very proud of my boys for everything they do and will encourage them till the day I die, these trophies will be given back until they EARN a real trophy. I'm sorry I'm not sorry for believing that everything in life should be earned and I'm not about to raise two boys to be men by making them believe that they are entitled to something just because they tried their best...cause sometimes your best is not enough, and that should drive you to want to do better...not cry and whine until somebody gives you something to shut u up and keep you happy."

As a surf instructor, once a student gets to his/her feet and rides down the wave, He/She has just become a surfer. I won't deny the simple fact that they rode on water. High-fives, congrats, welcome to your newest addiction. Wether they want to go from a first timer, to newbie, to beginner-intermediate, to typical surfer and beyond is up to them.

But once you committed to surfing and own your own board, I am not going to sugar coat things. Soup riding and going "straight" is not surfing. Just as if you invited a friend who says "he's a skier" to go on a skiing trip, and all he did was wedge / snow plough down the mountain. Would you consider him a skier ? Yes, he is going down the mountain riding on snow. But he is more controlling a fall then actually maneuvering his vehicle. Would you consider a person that can only drive a car in a straight line a driver ?

Sure there are those that say don't be so serious, surfing is about fun. Do you know who said " The best surfer out there is the one having the most fun. " ??? It was Duke Kahanamoku. And I have utmost respect for him. Do you have fun going straight ? Good. Do you need it to be perfect glassy 10-foot pipe to have fun ? Great. Do you need to catch at least 20 waves to consider it a good day ? Fine. Have fun in the ocean however it may be on what ever board ( or no board ) that may be. But if you say you're a "surfer", you better be able to surf.

When you ask questions on a "surfing" forum, you don't look for ways to be better at laying on your belly or riding soup. You want to get better, you want to turn, you want to go fast. The truth may hurt, you may suck, you may be not as good as others. I lost in the first round for four straight years before I made it to the next round. But that's what makes you try to improve, to " drive you to want to do better ". Nothing worthwhile in life ( and in surfing ) comes easy.

[drowningbitbybit]

Soup riding and going "straight" is not surfing.

Rubbish. It's not surfing very well, but it is surfing. It's not what you think of as surfing, but you can surf better than they can. If that's all someone can do, but they're trying, they're still a surfer.

I teach photography. Does owning a camera make you a photographer? No. Does getting interested in it, wanting to be better, and turning up on a saturday morning to do a workshop make them a photographer? Yes. Not necessarily a very good one, possibly a hopeless one, but still a photographer. I'm better than them... usually a lot better than them... does that give me the right to say what they do is not photography? No.

Is the guy who rents a foam board for an hour on holiday and faffs about in the whitewater a surfer? No.

Is the newbie who has bought a board and a wetsuit and is out there doing their best a surfer? Absolutely.

[Tudeo]

It's just a personal matter if you care if other people are calling you a real surfer or not. I surf for myself and couldn't care less how other people judge me. But I noticed in surfing culture there is this strong belonging to the group thing going on, I guess there it's important.

I can understand if u put in the hard work to become a real surfer in ur categorization of the world, it must be irritating when other people are claiming that honor trophy without justifying it.

I think it's about the question to be a soul surfer or to be a trophy surfer

[oldmansurfer]

I agree that participation trophies are fairly meaningless and that riding a wave straight to shore doesn't mean you are a surfer but you did surf. It's like saying you are a skateboarder when you just rode a few feet and fell down does that mean you are a skateboarder? No but you did try it. I also agree thought that if you persist at going straight to the shore for months on end then you are one of the worlds worst surfers but a surfer because you persist at it. If you are the best surfer in the world but no longer surf are you still a surfer? I would say no because you no longer persist at it.

[drowningbitbybit]

if you persist at going straight to the shore for months on end then you are one of the worlds worst surfers but a surfer because you persist at it.

Nicely put

I have friends in Sydney who have been surfing years and they're still happy if they catch one wave in a session, and I don't think I've ever seen them get properly onto a face, let alone do anything with it.

Sure, they're never going to win any trophies, but they're doing their best (again... and again... and again) and their participation is all that's required to be called a surfer.

[oldmansurfer]

When I was in karate class at the University of Hawaii there was one guy who was a brown belt. He was very slow and not very powerful. I think most of the whitebelts could beat him in a match but he had great form and he kept taking classes and taking the test for blackbelt. He was in karate classes since he was a kid and was trying to get black belt for around 7 years but because he wasn't good at fighting they never gave it to him until he had failed the test for 7 years. Then because of his dedication they gave him a blackbelt. I am not sure what to say about that. It seems to me that is like a participation trophy. But then 7 years....wow! That is incredible but in my opinion doesn't make him a blackbelt You might call him a karateka but he wasn't any good at kumite. I guess I was never big on the belts anyway since I could beat lots of the upper belts in kumite including blackbelts and I was a whitebelt. I suppose a surfer could be an expert at riding the whitewater to the shore but I don't think that means they should get a trophy for it but they would still be a surfer.

[yumyumyellow]

Waikikichan, I agree with you here. The important detail, though, is that the guy played it off as if all was going great on his way-too-small board and that he was getting along just fine. There is nothing "wrong" with riding straight in the soup if that's all you can do, but when you go against everyone's advice, pretend you're progressing just fine, and two months later you're actually just going straight in the white wash, it's different.

[oldmansurfer]

I know Waikikichan is worried about him learning bad habits or worse yet not learning anything more than riding whitewater. These are certainly possible outcomes but if he is enjoying the journey then none of that matters. I learned to surf 2 times and neither time did I ride whitewater straight in. I tried to catch unbroken waves and tried to get in front of the whitewater if I got caught by it and cut out if I could not get in front of the whitewater. I realize some people may find it difficult but for others the riding whitewater part is completely unecessary and slows down the learning. I rode whitewater when I first learned to bodysurf but not after that. However what it comes down to is if he is happy riding whitewater and isn't getting in the way of others or requiring lifesaving then it's what he enjoys. If he wanted to do more he would be asking us about it

[jaffa1949]

One of the poor psychological things our society is doing is giving hollow praise.
The "OH Dear" you didn't win but have a reward anyway, it builds up a false sense of achievement and cheapens the worth of the real prize.
The other similar one one is the never mind that you didn't succeed you can always try something else.
In order to succeed, you need to acknowledge the failure and build on them as lessons.
There is great enjoyment in learning and seeing your progress and fun achieving each little step.

What I see is our beginner in white water could be like Columbus as a Flat Earth Believer and never going beyond what is familiar.
But it is his journey and his set of beliefs ( the freedom to believe something we consider not much, as his whole world) held in spite of anything we might say.
What will the reality of his achievements be? Wish him joy in the trip!

[waikikikichan]

Great debate guys. Just so you know I did not make the post to discourage or put down anyone. I want to inspire beginners to get better at surfing. The whole reason I contribute to this forum is to help other surfers. My motto is " the best way to get rid of a Kook is to teach him the right way to surf ". That said let me answer back to the comments.

Tudeo -"I think it's about the question to be a soul surfer or to be a trophy surfer". The title of the post had trophy in it but that's not what's it about. It's about being so damn politically correct, parents not telling kids "NO", Why we keep lowering the standards in schools, sports not keeping scores so that there's no winners or losers. Why has society becomes like that ?
Yes, I do contest. But you know what ? I hate contest. " it brings out the worst in the human animal " as said by Chandler to Rick in the movie "North Shore", and it is so true.

OMS - good analogy of the skateboarder. So it got me thinking of other "er" and "ing"
" I can drive a car ....... but only straight ". Is he in control of the vehicle ? The part about driving is the actual steering part.
" I can Ski ....... but only snow plough or wedge ". Until he traverses right and left across the hill, he not really Ski "ing", he's just fighting the momentum of going down hill.
" I can ride a bike ....... but only if it has training wheels. Yes, kids learn to ride a bike and once there "capable" they take off the training wheels.
" I can ride ( down ) skateboard ramps ......... but I can't turn around and come back. Again it was more gravity doing the work not the rider. He was just along for the ride, like on a water park slide.
" I can type "( remember when you were a kid on a manual type writer, hitting the keys super fast at random) .......
"mwfjpoauonfnpehcnjusw doesn't make sense but at least I trying to type". If you Hunt and Peck type ( which I do ) is that typing ? Yes. but when someone says they can type, they should be able type "The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" without looking down.

My point is when are you a driver, a skier, a bike rider, a person that can type ? Sure we can have different levels. I can drive a car. Stop, Go, turn right , turn left. parallel park, etc. Can I Drift ? No.

YYY - Yes the statement of "I got this "down" in my mind means I can control the board, do the dance steps, make a delicious meal. But the post wasn't so much about that comment. It's about why it's okay to be in the soup. The person said he wants to ride across the wave, so great. He wants to improve. I know beginners watch the surfers " out back " and say to themselves " Wow, I want to be there, I want to do what they're doing ! ". I want to them to say " I don't want to be here, I want to be there ". I asked my wife, remember when you first started in the soup ? She said " to me, I felt I was surfing ". Was it fun ? " she said "Yes". Now that you can surf across the face, how does that feel ? " Amazing, so much better ". Yes, they are learning to surf in the soup, it just a step to take to the next level where they can really surf once they get to the open face. Let's inspire them to get there.

[oldmansurfer]

I heard recently someone making a point that if you haven't been surfing for a certain amount of time you aren't a surfer. You are trying to make a point that if you can't get in front of the whitewater you aren't a surfer. I would say as long as you try you are a surfer. If you quit trying then no matter how good you got before you quit you used to surf and are no longer a surfer but if you continue to surf no matter how lousy you are you are still a surfer. The Hawaiians used to ride big wooden boards and beginners went straight in to shore lying on their belly. That would have been called surfing. It was only the good surfers who stood up. The Hawaiians would have said they were good because they can stand up and ride the board to the beach. What constitutes surfing has changed radically over the past 100 years. They do things now that were undreamed of and impossible back then. To say someone who rides a board straight in is not a surfer seems too elitist for me.

[drowningbitbybit]

I would say as long as you try you are a surfer.

Spot on.

[waikikikichan]

You are trying to make a point that if you can't get in front of the whitewater you aren't a surfer. -- To say someone who rides a board straight in is not a surfer seems too elitist for me.

No No not at all what I believe. Look at what I wrote.

As a surf instructor, once a student gets to his/her feet and rides down the wave, He/She has just become a surfer.

Anyone who rides a wave is a surfer. In a simple sense, moving a long by the waves energy on a surfboard, boogieboard, air mattress, etc., you technically are a wave rider, thus a surfer.

Just like Jaffa alluded to, that at the moment that is all they know. They are just thrilled at the fact of being in motion of the ocean, it is a great feeling. The feeling a lot of us have forgotten.

Maybe it is more correct to say that if you only can go straight or ride for a few seconds in the white water that you are a "beginner surfer on his/her way to becoming a real surfer".

Again I can say "I can cook". I can boil hot water to make instant ramen, slap cheese and ham between two pieces of bread, and pour milk over my cereal, but that's about it. But most people wouldn't say that's cooking. Why not ?

It may seem the posting is elitist, but again I want to inspire encourage those in the white water to reach for more. Remember the teacher or coach that made the most impact on your life ? Was he/she the one that let you take the easy way out ? Did he push you to go one step further when you think you couldn't ? It's frustrating for students ( and for the instructor ) to learn how to cutback or noseride. But once they can cutback or noseride, they are so stoked and grateful. I never had a student say "man, I wish I never learned how to ride along the wave's face and trim".

Let's get them to not feel it's not okay to be in the soup. Sure at the beginning it fine, we all have to start somewhere. As I say and believe "being in the white water soup is Riding on the board, it's when you get on the face is where you can begin to "surf" your board". I want them know that being on the waves face gliding along is where the true surfing is.

[Tudeo]

If the OP meant his post as a motivational speech for a learner, it's fine by me. There are many ways to stimulate a student. One of my old boxing trainers always shouted: "It's your own body!", when torturing us to do more and more situps.

If the OP meant his post to state u must earn the title surfer, then I agree to a point. The question is where to draw the line?

I agree with OMS on the lurking dangers of elitism in surfing. Well, that's not exactly what OMS said but it's what I make of it

[oldmansurfer]

Waikikichan I think I understand your reasons and it is all coming from the surf instructors point of veiw. I haven't ever taught anyone how to surf or ever got any instructions other than "stand up and ride the board in." I know you have a good perspective on what it takes to help surfers get better. let me ask you this, Do you ever see a surfer who doesn't care if they get better or perhaps that it isn't very important that they get better?

[waikikikichan]

Do you ever see a surfer who doesn't care if they get better or perhaps that it isn't very important that they get better?

Oh Yes, all the time. They are very content at the point they are at. And some are my friends. They rather sit off to the side. I would say come over here, the waves are better. " Nah, I fine here " is their response. Some will never nose ride or do a cutback, but they love surfing. The hardest person to convince to get better was my wife. I think one time she threatened to drive back home without me, from all the stress i was giving her. Now, I wish I didn't train her so well, because she calls me off waves now.

[waikikikichan]

If the OP meant his post to state u must earn the title surfer, then I agree to a point. The question is where to draw the line?

Again, If you ride the wave you are a surfer. I never said " if you go straight in the white water / soup, then you are not a surfer". You are a surfer, it's just that you're Riding the board, instead of Surfing the board.

Think of everything you love of about surfing on your board. ( not the ocean, sun, not working, bikinis, etc. ). Just as the question was asked "what makes surfing FUN ?" Other than the wave conditions itself and the crowd, list the actual things.

Bottom turn - not possible if you go straight
Solid power turn / Cutback / Carves / Spray - no face to turn off of
Ride a long distance - sure if you stay on and not get bounced off and the crumbling wave keep going you can ride to your fin hits something
But if you ride along the waves face it is longer and you end up out of the turbulence zone for a safer paddle back
Ups and Downs / rollercoasters ( one of my favorites ) - you can't pump in the soup. you can hop but it's not the same.
Floaters - you can maybe do a white water bounce wiggling side to side.
Ride backside - there is not front or back really if you're going straight.
Noseride - Not possible without the curl to lock down the tail.
Trim ( the true essence of surfing ) - going straight you can't trim
And the Ultimate Maneuver in Surfing,
getting Tubed or Barreled - sometimes if you go straight you end up getting covered by the breaking lip that goes over your head, but that's not a barrel ride.

Look at all those thing that surfers LOVE to do while surfing. Yet all can NOT be done going straight. Yes, you are riding the wave. But you can't do any of the things that let you SURF the wave

[Big H]

Was at a break with a lot of beginners yesterday....took off on a left and had to cut back as the person dropping in on me thought it was a right.....another wave I got up and got dropped in on by a straight rider, cut back and there was another one behind me....lost the wave at that point.....oh well.....

[billie_morini]

Gotta contribute to this and no offense intended to W.Chan.
1. Trophies for everyone and not keeping score is stupid and, as George Carlin put it, contributed to the pu**ification of America
2. The competitive kids keep score despite the silly beliefs of their misguided parents
3. Lighten up, W.Chan because the surfer that is having the most fun is the best surfer (doesn't matter if he straight-lines it or catches only 1 wave/season. In one stressful work season, all I was capable of was paddling outback, soaking my aching head in the cold sea, and watching the others do the surfing. I play guitar to relax, not to become exceptional with it. Consequently, I say, "I play guitar, but do not profess to be a 'guitar player.'" Some approach surfing this way.)