Which board would make it to the backline first?

[mg100]

This may seem like a very kook question but I have been out a few times this month where I just couldn't make it to the backline and have been very frustrated, this doesn't normally happen.
Other guys were out so it can be done, although I know very well paddling is not one of my strong points, I guess its improved in 4-5 years but still have a long way to go.
I looked for any rips, any brakes in sets and the old technic of paddling as hard as you could but just wasn't happening.
They were very short sets, not huge waves, only 4ft but with a bigger 8ft ones that would wipe me out just as I was about to pass the break and push me back to shore to start all over again.
I was trying to paddle out on my 36lt hybrid fish, I just wondered if my 28lt shortboard would have been easier or harder to paddle out?
The fish I guess would paddle faster but I cannot duck dive it as deep.
The shortboard is soooo much easier to duck dive but maybe slower to paddle.
Which would make it to the backline first?

[jaffa1949]

If you can't paddle out in the conditions and other people are out, doesn't matter what board you have, it is your getting out ability that is woeful, especially if there s a range of all sorts of boards out there?
Nature's rejection process, really!
You say paddling is not one of your strong points, that's over 90% of surf in the weak zone, duckdiving not a prime skill Either?
Being brutal in my assessment, you really have to get this working!

[mg100]

Haha, thank you for your brutal reply.
I do need to step up my game.
Can most surfers, or decent surfers I should say able to get out in almost anything?
My local break has a pier so getting too used to cheating to get out.
It doesn’t happen often but when it does and it looks fun at the back it’s annoying.
I surf 5 times a week, I really thought my paddling would be up to scratch by now, haha, stupid fitness.

[oldmansurfer]

I use boards with huge amounts of volume in surf that keep other surfers out. Partially it's timing and reading the ocean and partially fitness and skills for dealing with breaking waves and partially it's mental (as in mental illness....just kidding but I go out in surf that no one else wants). There are some breaks where you can get out in almost anything and some where the size limits who can get out ultimately letting no one out but the number of surfers who can get out tapers off with size and what may seem impossible to one surfer is doable to another. The break I surf the current will sometimes limit your surf session because the sweep is so powerful it will take you out of the lineup if you don't catch a wave soon enough. So surfers can get out but staying out is another story. However some surfers will find it difficult/impossible just to get out through the shorebreak at my home break.

[BoMan]

Here are a few suggestions....
1. Be aware that shore dump is strongest at high tide and weakest at low tide

2. Time your entry between sets. (Look for patterns from shore - 3 waves/set, 5 minutes between sets, waves break every 12 seconds)

3. Look for gaps in the waves caused by deep spots or rips and look for a line to the outside

4. Once you decide to go - sprint!

5. If you get caught inside, sea anchor the board and catch your breath. (slide back, bring the nose up, egg beater around to face the shore and take the foam wall on your back)

6. Work on paddle fitness. I swim in a pool 2 times/week. (DTC is the forum expert and may chime in)

[jaffa1949]

Haha, thank you for your brutal reply.
I do need to step up my game.
Can most surfers, or decent surfers I should say able to get out in almost anything?
I surf 5 times a week, I really thought my paddling would be up to scratch by now, haha, stupid fitness.

The reject button still functions on me more often now than previously.
I am recovering from serious surgery and radiotherapy almost two years since.
My ego sees surf I could handle before that, but if there is a fair challenge getting out , I have difficulties, I surf a long board!
I can often still get out, if I really push it but then catching fitness is lessened.
Doing land work, gym work, all the applied things, but have now discovered that a set of nerve centres to my right leg are insulted ( less than total,damage) by the radiation. They are currently not fully able to respond to pop up requests.
Currently retraining other nerve links to take up,the response.
I turn 70 this year, I am working my butt off to have a surfing life again, do the hard yards to get your self fit.
Being surf fit before cancer and operation saved my life. Getting my full life back is getting that fitness back.
As fit as you can be is a benefit across all your life!

Want inspiration, and it certainly is one of mine!
Check out: adaptivesurf.com

[waikikikichan]

I was trying to paddle out on my 36lt hybrid fish, I just wondered if my 28lt shortboard would have been easier or harder to paddle out?
The fish I guess would paddle faster but I cannot duck dive it as deep.
The shortboard is soooo much easier to duck dive but maybe slower to paddle.

Which would make it to the backline first?

What you want to hear: Probably this a mathematical question. If the fish shape can go at a straight line speed of 5 mph, but gets knocked back 10 feet and loses 5 seconds each time getting back up to speed. How, would it compare to a shortboard shape that can only paddle at 3 mph, yet loses less time and push back ?
There's too many variables in the real world ( wave's dump / churning, your duck dive technique, etc. ) , but someone might be able to figure out the calculations.

What you don't want to hear:
1) If you can't make it out, YOU don't belong out.
2) Boards have no potential on their own. Like a computer, bowling ball or paint brush, they are nothing without the user.
3) Why are you on a 28 L shortboard and yet not a strong paddler ?
4) Where are you ending up your rides at ? Are you going down the line and finishing on your feet on the shoulder. Or are you ending up surrounded by foam after jumping off the board in the center of the break ?

[waikikikichan]

Can most surfers, or decent surfers I should say able to get out in almost anything?

They were very short sets, not huge waves, only 4ft but with a bigger 8ft ones that would wipe me out just as I was about to pass the break and push me back to shore to start all over again.

What is a decent surfer ? What is the average surfer in your parts compared to the average surfer in Hawaii or average surfer in Japan. A pro longboard surfer in Japan could get smoked by a local little kid from Hawaii.
Most " decent surfers " , know when to go and when not to go ( in terms of catching waves and paddling back out ) . They paddle Smarter not Harder. I know surfers that's been surfing for over 15 years and still can't paddle well.
If you had good paddling skills, you wouldn't have needed to ask the question in the first place. You would've already realized it didn't matter which board.

Only 4 feet with occasional 8 feet clean up waves ? Is that average or "decent" in your part of the world ? 4-6 occasional 8 is way way different in Hawaii. That's why it's hard to determine what an average / decent wave or surfer is.

[oldmansurfer]

I think a big mistake that people make is to assume that the waves are breaking every where randomly. If they were, then no one would be surfing there. There would be no lineup, no point in waiting in a particular spot for wave since they will be breaking everywhere. Another mistake people make in going out is to try to go to the shortest route to the lineup but what you want is the shortest route to outside of the break. Once you are outside you can casually paddle over to the break how ever far away it is. Waves don't break randomly. The laws of physics dictate where and when they will break. Perhaps something to do is to watch how others get out. Not just one guy but lots of them watch where they paddle and what they do when waves come. This will give you options although maybe you still can't do what they are doing but in the future you can shoot for that type of entry but for now find an easier one or get into shape.

[mg100]

Cheers BoMan (not women thank you autocorrect) for your tips, most helpful.
I have also had a bad shoulder for a long time, working on strengthening it with the bands and various exercises, of course this does not help my paddling but I have to be careful of overdoing it, maybe swimming is a good idea if we get 3-4 days without surf as i know this would help but if its only a day I know it needs a rest, i'll try fit swimming in when I can though.
I also try get to the gym but again I have to be careful of overworking my shoulder, basically if I don't surf I try do some exercise every day.

1) If you can't make it out, YOU don't belong out. - haha I knew this was coming, the waves were not intimidating, I can surf in much bigger condition, the whole of last year there were about 4 times in total I couldn't get out, unfortunately three of those times were in the same month.
If I know the waves are too big for me or the ocean is too crazy and I know I cannot swim back in I will stay on land, but it normally only happens if there is a cyclone.

3) Why are you on a 28 L shortboard and yet not a strong paddler ? - Its a good point, It is in my quiver but I don't ride it too much, its fun when I am up and riding but yeah it is much harder work to get on the waves, might actually change this board to around the 30-31lt mark.

4) Where are you ending up your rides at ? Are you going down the line and finishing on your feet on the shoulder. Or are you ending up surrounded by foam after jumping off the board in the center of the break ? - at the moment it is around half and half to be honest, most of the spots I surf are beach breaks which can close out quite a lot, I am also just starting to generate my own speed at the moment to be able to get round section, work in progress.

Sorry to hear about your challenges Jaffa, I am 37 but it sounds like you could still kick my ass.

Oldman - cheers, I went back to this spot again yesterday, more people out this time (I could get out, yay) but found the secret, there are some rocks a little around the corner, not sticking out of the water much but most guys jump from here.

[jaffa1949]

Therein is a lesson, piers and rock offs,understanding the topography that aids you get out a valuable skill.
Oblique ways out are better than trying to Rambo out!.
Bit still increasing paddle endurance strength and CAPABILITY, is vital.
Watch the various guys you surf with, some seem to,have an effortless guide onto the wave, other thrash like a demented epileptic spider, and the initial part of their ride is a chaotic recovery to a riding balance.
Real skill often seems like ease, but is an understanding of body positioning and well applied moment strength!
Watch and perceive!

[Oldie]

.. other thrash like a demented epileptic spider, and the initial part of their ride is a chaotic recovery to a riding balance.
...

So you did see a video of me .... My biggest issue as it is soo inefficient.

Still in search of that smoothness, this kind of relaxed power that looks so easy, yet is so difficult to achieve, I assume this is a mix of experience, feeling for the wave, technique and strength? Any advice on how to get better in this.?

[oldmansurfer]

Oldman - cheers, I went back to this spot again yesterday, more people out this time (I could get out, yay) but found the secret, there are some rocks a little around the corner, not sticking out of the water much but most guys jump from here.

Hahaha Well that's great! Similar advice has been given numerous times but this is the first time I recall hearing that it was such a simple solution. A couple notes of caution here. First make sure you also watch how surfers come back in in conditions that you have trouble getting out especially those requiring rock entries. Then the difficulty and danger of rock entries go up depending on the conditions so just because you know how doesn't mean that if the waves are twice as big you should go out. Ideally you would work your way up in size slowly practicing the rock entry as the size of waves increases in slightly bigger and bigger conditions (and different tides as well). I am glad it solved your problem but you should still work on your fitness