Shortboard take-off

[averagejoebiden]

Hey guys, 25 yr old from Capetown. Been surfing for about 3 years and decided to transition to a "real" shortboard 3 months ago from my retro fish. Its a pyzalien 5'10 x 18.25 x 2.25 x 26.2L. I'm almost 6'2 foot tall and I ate xxxxx for the first month or so going almost everyday. Right now I'm pretty used to it, can go down the line, top bottom turns, some cutbacks much more easily. However, i pearl ALOT. I've looked up but got mixed answers in regards to body positioning on board. Many say the nose should be barely above the water or even partially submerged. However, I see some local rippers and their nose is at least 4 inches above the waterline when paddling into a wave. What are some reasons for pearling? Where should the nose roughly be when paddling into wave versus normal paddling? Someone help me!!!!!! Thanks so much, have a great day

[Lebowski]

As others have told you, the nose should be barely above the surface, or even slightly under while paddling on flat water. You should be able to control whether it goes under or comes out based on your paddling speed and using your lower back muscles to arch your back. Don't fixate on the nose while you're paddling into a wave, you should be busy looking at the wave and paddling hard. You need to feel the balance when you're catching a wave. There is a 'tipping point' that you can feel where you're basically balanced right on the point of catching the wave. When you feel the tipping point you can just throw some weight forward during your pop up and get straight to your feet.

Retro fish boards tend to have a volume of around 35 litres at a guess. Your new board is a pretty large step down in volume which may mean that you're struggling with paddle power, and hence are only catching waves at their most critical (and difficult to handle).

[dtc]

Keep in mind what is causing perling - its not the nose being too low when you are paddling, its the tail of the board being lifted by the wave and forcing the nose under

(note: following is a bit simplistic but good enough)

what causes the tail to lift: when the wave speed hits the tail of the board and the differential between the wave speed and the board speed is too great. The wave moves under the board and the board tail gets lifted (if you are moving fast enough, the wave catches the board and pushes it along and you then surf)

why is the differential too great: because you arent paddling fast enough

what helps you paddle faster: putting the board on the most efficient plane ie as flat to the water as possible.

so...if your nose is way in the air, you paddle slower, which mean you have a great chance of being too slow when the wave hits you, which mean you have a greater chance of perling

however - if you are a really good paddler, then you can have your nose in the air a bit, because your paddling ability overcomes it. Just like a great cyclist will beat you on an old bike, even if you are on a modern carbon fibre bike, a great paddler can beat you even if s/he isnt being the most efficient

note: wave positioning can also overcome paddling issue. If you are in just the right spot on the wave, then you dont need to paddle much - hence no paddle or one paddle take offs. So those rippers you are watching are probably better paddlers than you and better at positioning than you

answer: you need to put your board on the most efficient plane to allow you to paddle the fastest you can. Which is nose just above water

bonus answer: nose rocker also significantly affects paddling efficiency. The greater the rocker, the harder it is to move the board through the water. So the higher performance short boards with significant rocker create extra issues over a longer and generally flatter board. Not much you can do about this, the board is the board.

[oldmansurfer]

I want to know when exactly do you pearl ? While paddling for the wave? at the bottom of the wave? on steep waves? Any wave? What part of the wave are you taking off at? Are you going straight toward the beach or angled?

[averagejoebiden]

Thanks Lebowski and dtc for the advice!
@oldmansurfer I would be paddling hard and I would feel the wave catch me, but before i can pop up, the whole board just digs and I get thrown forward.. It happens on mellow waves too but mostly steeper waves. Im usually on or close to the peak.

I would like to add that when I paddle into a wave, my chin is always on the board and my head is down, I only arch my back during the pop up. I tried taking off on the shoulder a few times, wave would just pass me no matter how hard i paddled.

[oldmansurfer]

perhaps the problem would be solved by arching your back when you paddle

[RinkyDink]

I've been surfing on a shorter board 7'4" (really a fish) and I find it incredibly helpful to angle my takeoffs by steering my board with my chest while my arms keep paddling (I hope I'm not stating the obvious because that was an important insight for me). Anyway, I've never perled on an angled takeoff, but I have going straight. Sometimes I'll paddle my board horizontally along the impact zone to get myself in the right position for the peak. When the wave approaches I steer my board with my chest & torso so I'm paddling into the angle along the face of the wave that I want to go in. When it works out well, I can drop down into the trough of the wave diagonally across the wave face. I've had to really work on that takeoff because the waves at my spot are really fast. You have to get in front of the pocket quickly or you'll end up kicking out in white water.

By the way, take my advice with a grain of salt. I'm still a beginner trying to figure it all out myself.

[dtc]

It could be either slow paddling, or not paddling for long enough. the former - pretty much as soon as the wave hits the board you perl.

the latter - the wave catches you and you go forward a little bit, then you 'perl'. In reality, you get caught up in the lip and thrown over the wave. The failure is called 'not breaking the ledge' in surf lingo. Often its due to stopping paddling too early (not paddling down the face of the wave ) or not positioning yourself under the lip as is required with a short board (longer boards you have much more leeway with positioning)

linking to another forum... but look for the post by 'Nick Carroll' about half way down this page. Nick is brother of Tom (former world champ) and a pretty good surfer himself, so worth reading

http://forum.realsurf.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19224

[waikikikichan]

1) When you ride your retro fish, does the pearling problem go away ?
2) Are you getting thrown forward straight or are you getting flap jacked over, heels over head ?
3) Are you also kicking during the paddle ?
4) Does your break have a "Back Wash" that runs thru the peak. Could it be the Back Wash that's slamming into you and stopping your momentum ?
5) Are you trying to catch "Double Ups".

[Lebowski]

I would like to add that when I paddle into a wave, my chin is always on the board and my head is down, I only arch my back during the pop up. I tried taking off on the shoulder a few times, wave would just pass me no matter how hard i paddled.

Keep your head up high when you're paddling. Use your lower back muscles to really lift your upper body off the board, pretty much as high as you can. When you paddle like this, you engage your back muscles as well as your arms and shoulders. When you paddle with your head down low, your paddling is weak and strenous because the water level is high up on your arms, so not only is it harder to do the paddle stroke, but the 'recovery' stroke (bringing your arm back from your waist to the front again) is much more difficult and tiring. The only time your head should go down closer to the board is perhaps with the last paddle or two, if you need an extra push just to get that weight forward at the tipping point.

[RinkyDink]

You might also want to check whether your board is the right size for you. I just glanced at the dimensions of your board when I first read your post, but it's possible that your board is too short. I'm not an expert in this area. However, when I see you're 6'2" and riding a 5'10" I suspect you might not have enough float in your board, depending on your weight. It might help to double check to make sure there's enough volume in your board. I know one of the questions I have about shortboarding is how short should I go? I really don't have a clue, but there has to be some point where going shorter has diminishing returns (board becomes too uncontrollable, not enough float, etc.). What advantage is there to riding a 5'10" board over 6'4"? I don't know, but it's one of those questions in the back of my mind. In other words, I'm not a good enough shortboarder to really have any idea how much difference a few inches in length or width makes. Anyway, your board could possibly be the problem so you might want to double check whether it's a good fit for you.

[waikikikichan]

It’s not the 5’10” length that surprised me, but the 18.25” width. Closer to 19” would be more appropriate.

[Big H]

I would like to add that when I paddle into a wave, my chin is always on the board and my head is down, I only arch my back during the pop up. I tried taking off on the shoulder a few times, wave would just pass me no matter how hard i paddled.

Do like OMS and Lebo said....opposite of what you do pretty much.....arch like you have a string pulling the top of your head up to the sky when paddling for the wave.....after you practice this you will feel the power leverage you have paddling this way and the pitch control (nose up nose down control) you have. On weak waves I cheat and the nose of the board will actually be under water if I am not arching hard.....but arch hard and the nose comes up.....paddle for the wave and then when you are at the right spot (feeling), you "dive" into the wave, tipping the nose over and getting in. Steep, fast waves you arch hard and just get up, no diving in needed.

BTW, that is a super small board you're on. Local rippers here still use boards that are taller than they are.

[oldmansurfer]

Surfing is so complex. I think people see pro surfers doing all these things and think "if I had a board just like theirs I could do the same things" but in reality if the pro surfers had their board they could do the same things just not quite as well as they do them with the boards they have. For pro surfers it seems an inch in length makes a noticeable difference but for most surfers they wouldn't notice an inch difference because the performance level is much less. Anyway the thing is that surfing is so complex. There are many different factors that go into a problem like pearling at the top of the wave. Maybe we should make a list? I'll start with them most obvious
1) Positioning on the board. If you are too far forward the nose goes under pretty simple. However if you are too far back the board is angled and you are pushing too much water to paddle well and the wave will lift the tail and shove the nose under. Bigger boards have a larger area where you can lay to paddle without problems. Smaller boards you need to be in the right place just an inch or two one way or the other alters how the board paddles however you can also alter it by pressing your head down or lifting your legs. Rocker also affects how much leeway you have in positioning. More rocker is more forgiving (but slower). Where to be exactly on the board is not the same for everyone. It depends on your distribution of weight. If you have huge thick legs or skinny legs will alter where you should be on the board. So you have to try slight changes on a short board and see what they do. Feel free to add subtract or make number 2

[oldmansurfer]

2) Wave aberrations. This is the one that makes me pearl at the top. Chop or boils or double waves or backwash can cause your board to pearl at the top of the wave although usually I just keep going and the nose pops out. The waves I surf have lots of abberations

[oldmansurfer]

3) Not paddling well enough to match the speed of the wave. I mentioned in number one how that occurs. The speed is too slow and the lip jacks up and pushes the tail up and the nose down. There is more than one reasons why this happens. So it could be from incorrect position on the board (too far back) or you are just plain too weak for the board you are using or you have incorrect paddling technique and I suppose it might be from taking off in the wrong position depending on the wave.

[one0one]

Take off on angle and get rail engaged as early as possible. If you are regular and going right it will be the toes on your right foot you need to press down on to get the rail knife ing or engaged in the face as early as possible. Vice versa heel of both legs backside.

If you pearl on turns could be low volume board for ability or size of waves.

Hope you get some ideas

[one0one]

Had a read of thread. Your board is definitely under volume for weight and ability. More volume is more waves usually meaning faster learning and more fun