Surfing Waves

Hi, we had a bit of an incident today and Bude beach when me and about eight other kayakers went for a Sunday morning surf, I was so shocked and annoyed I felt compelled to post this:


Earlier today me and some of my fellow kayaking friends decided that the water levels in the rivers around Dartmoor where too low to warrant a river paddle, instead we diced to head over to Bude for a spot of surfing. It turned out to be a nice day with good surf and it was turning out to be a nice day. That is until a small minority of the surfers decided that they have a good given right to the waves. I understand that it was very busy but while me and a friend of mine where surfing a wave a surfer cam shooting along the wave into us both. Now Im not quite up to scratch on the etiquette of the waves but I strongly believe that we where doing nothing wrong as we got on the wave said surfer was heading in the opposite direction to us but as the direction of the wave changed he turned back towards us and only narrowly avoided hitting us, this resulted in all three of us falling of the wave. It was a bit annoyed but it wasn't the and of the world, after all there are many more waves to come! What came next really shocked and surprised me, the surfer cam swimming over F'ing and blinding. Every other word out of his mouth was a swear word. He was going on about 'learning the F'ing rules' and 'That's what F'ing rivers are F'ing for' (you get my drift). To be honest I wasn't listening that much because anything with that amount of swear words is not normally constructive. What came next was worse, he picked up his board and threw it at me (I'm fairly sure that would constitute assault)! I understand that surfers ride across the wave and that us paddlers ride perpendicular to the shore and that this causes problems but this really was unacceptable. Even if for any reason we where in error, this is most certainly not the way to go about correcting it. I was really surprised, I'd always considered the surfing community to be a nice bunch and I'm hoping this was a one off. However, other members of my group also said that they felt very unwelcome and that there seemed to be one rule for surfers and one rule for the rest of us. Going back to what this surfer said though, I wasn't aware that as kayakers we are apparently only allowed on rivers and that the sea/surf is only for surfers. It was not just me this person shouted abuse at either, we had a couple of relatively new people (who never strayed more than about five meters from the shore) and I doubt they'll be surfing again soon. No matter what we had done wrong, this behaviour is unacceptable.

Okay, rant over, I would also like to say that it did seem to be the minority who where set on ruining the day and that a few other surfers I chatted to seemed very nice. It was also nice to so many people out enjoying the surf. I just hope that who ever this person was they feel like a right Muppet and that this isn't the kind of welcome newcomers receive in general.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, if you have anything to say please post a reply.
Have a nice evening,
Tom

I have a Scupper (ocean kayak) and have ridden waves with it but not where there were surfers. Being both a surfer and a kayaker I would not go to ride waves where there were surfers or if I did I would follow the rules of the lineup for surfing. If kayakers were out first and the surfers came out to your spot than I would think they have no right to complain. I guess some surfers may expect you to know the rules without telling you what they are. He really should have explained the rules to you (then get upset if you don't follow them.) Surfers get upset at other surfers for the same reason. Surfers come in all varieties. If it were me surfing there, I would tell you how you were screwing up and if you persisted I would either ignore you or go in.

My view is, if you are not up on SURFING etiquette you should not be riding 10ft+ bullets on a surfers break. they are dangerous much like SUP's especially around people on tiny boards.

Now, im not saying they have right over the break, but do you really think you should have kayaks, where swimmers and surfers both frequent?

Being a kayaker myself i would NEVER dream of taking it to a surf break EVER, next time just call it off and arrange for another day.

Let's start this conversation witha bit of reality. Physical abuse is not OK, verbal abuse also not so good especially a torrent of FFFFings doesn't get a point across at all.
The surfing community has its share of muppets on all manner of boards.
As to kayaks not being allowed in the surf, there is probably no rule limiting them to rivers.

Now let's look at your contribution to the situation.
Turning up at at enmass on board or kayak at a crowded location creates an greater chance of encountering hostility.
Turning up and not knowing the unwritten rule so line behaviour increases the likely hood of hostility.
Kayaks may feel comfortable riding waves together especially standing waves in a river, this does not apply in the surf. The surfer may well have been going away from you when he took off but was possibly setting up a big turn to come in the opposite direction.
Best rule and an area where most friction occurs , first surfer on and closest to the curl has right of way and choices of direction. Best option one surfer on the wave. You certainly broke that.
Another thing kayaks are feared in the surf for good reason, they are nowhere near as surf manouverable and are therefore as unable to avoid collisions and they are heaver and possibly more harmful.

Any person it the surf not knowing the workings of the line up and how it is surfed, constitutes a hazard.
All this could have been avoided in two ways, the kayakers/ new surfers/ learners being aware of what you are getting into and taking a wave maybe out of the crowd.
Secondly a surfer explaining respectfully what the surf offers and where in the line up would be most suitable.

Sadly the assumption that a learner, inexperienced surfer/kayaker can jus paddle out and have a jolly time at any break is a myth.
Sometimes just paddling out has the same risk as driving a Volkswagen beetle onto a formula one track.

A question for you to consider, had you ever gone kayak surfing yourself?

BTW you have every right to go surfing but you have every responsibility to ensure that you are doing it with awareness and safety, which IMHO you didn't

Tomagone wrote: we got on the wave said surfer was heading in the opposite direction to us but as the direction of the wave changed he turned back towards us and only narrowly avoided hitting us, this resulted in all three of us falling of the wave.

You were in the wrong.

Tomagone wrote:Every other word out of his mouth was a swear word. ...he picked up his board and threw it at me

He was in the wrong.

Allow me to clarify, I consider my self a competent paddler and I was in full control the whole time, as where all the paddlers on the break. I'm fully aware of the etiquette as where most of the other paddlers. The beginners where kept well away from the break and where
just splashing about in shallows.
As for calling the whole thing off, that wasn't really and option, we're based in Surrey so its a bit of a trek, when we arrived it wasn't very busy at all, however, if the situation had warranted it, we would have made a judgment call as to if we paddle or not.
We did also keep to the otherside of the surfers, but once it got busy this became difficult due to the large numbers of surfers.

We where also closest to the curl at the point of starting to paddle, in order to catch the wave.

well there may be different rules at different lineups. Some lineups you rotate through so one you catch a wave you go to the end of the rotation and wait for your turn. This is why SUPs can be such a disturbing thing to surfers because they can catch waves way outside of where the surfers can and skip the rotation. Kayaking would be the same way. I know it is difficult to describe the exact situation but perhaps you could try again to describe exactly how things went down.

Tom, It seems you are trying to justify having a kayak in the surf, as jaffa stated they are bigger, hurt more and you cannot turn at a whim like a surfboard, you may feel like your in control, but the simple fact is, kayaks have a longer turning circle.

The fact you stayed outside the other surfers in my eyes makes it even worse, this means you have first pick on waves, a surfer may be further inside try to take a wave and bam ur beside him. They virtually have no chance if you are on the outside especially if all you can do is go straight. Kayaks are for kayaking, not surfing.

I know most surfers would not verbally abuse or physically assault you, but I do think most surfers would be really frustrated if a group of kayakers showed up at their favorite surf break. There aren't many places here where the waves break just right for surfing, but there are many places that I would imagine a kayak could catch them if all you want to do is just ride the wave in, which is a reason I would get frustrated to see kayaks at a surfing spot. There are plenty of kayakers on the ocean around Malibu, but I really couldn't imagine any of them thinking it was a good idea to go ride the waves where people are surfing.

Tomagone wrote:Allow me to clarify, I consider my self a competent paddler and I was in full control the whole time, as where all the paddlers on the break. I'm fully aware of the etiquette as where most of the other paddlers. The beginners where kept well away from the break and where
just splashing about in shallows.
As for calling the whole thing off, that wasn't really and option, we're based in Surrey so its a bit of a trek, when we arrived it wasn't very busy at all, however, if the situation had warranted it, we would have made a judgment call as to if we paddle or not.
We did also keep to the otherside of the surfers, but once it got busy this became difficult due to the large numbers of surfers.

Competent paddler does not equal competent surfer, Most kayaks going straight to the beach in control does not equal surfing and is going against the general direction of traffic.
you say in you first post " Now I'm not quite up to scratch on the etiquette of the waves - " Then you say "I'm fully aware of the etiquette as where most of the other paddlers "

You say on the other side of the surfers just specifically which other side, you say closer to the curl, but further outside.
The only members of your party that were doing the right thing were the beginners who kept close to shore.

The simple answer is that surfer's response was totally inappropriate but it came from provocation where you guys came on mass with an attitude of we have come miles and we are going out regardless. You made a judgement call and it was not right!

I'll restate the obvious which you couldn't see


You have every right to go surfing but you have every responsibility to ensure that you are doing it with awareness and safety, which IMHO you didn't -

Last little bit if a group of you turned up at a local break and were told politely to choose somewhere else what would be your response?

jaffa1949 wrote:

Tomagone wrote:Allow me to clarify, I consider my self a competent paddler and I was in full control the whole time, as where all the paddlers on the break. I'm fully aware of the etiquette as where most of the other paddlers. The beginners where kept well away from the break and where
just splashing about in shallows.
As for calling the whole thing off, that wasn't really and option, we're based in Surrey so its a bit of a trek, when we arrived it wasn't very busy at all, however, if the situation had warranted it, we would have made a judgment call as to if we paddle or not.
We did also keep to the otherside of the surfers, but once it got busy this became difficult due to the large numbers of surfers.

Competent paddler does not equal competent surfer, Most kayaks going straight to the beach in control does not equal surfing and is going against the general direction of traffic.
you say in you first post " Now I'm not quite up to scratch on the etiquette of the waves - "

You say on the other side of the surfers just specifically which other side, you say closer to the curl, but further outside.
The only members of your party that were doing the right thing were the beginners who kept close to shore.

The simple answer is that surfer's response was totally inappropriate but it came from provocation where you guys came on mass with an attitude of we have come miles and we are going out regardless. You made a judgement call and it was not right!

Some how i dont think he got the response's he expect but u put it very well jaffa..

Tom -Its not a good idea to show up to a crowded surf spot on a kayak. And it sounds like you don't know anything about etiquette. Just bad all the way around.

Wait, Tomagone! You had paddles? Why didn't you simply smack the guy from arm's length?

Kayak? Really? "I understand that it's very bussy..." then you are in the wrong place for kayaks. Look, I got nothing against kayakers, but if you really wanted to get along you would have taken a few less waves.

Especially with 8 of you..

I watched a kayak today in and among the surf line-up today in Ventura County, California. The kayak was long and made of wood. The guy was positioned a bit off to the side and didn't race into to take waves the board surfers were taking. Just when I thought this guy might be OK, he was toppled by a wave that caught him broadside. He fell out of and was separated from his kayak. At this point, there was a 14 or 15 foot wooden kayak being thrashed around by the surf. My concern was for the board surfers. None were hurt, but they could have been.

Conclusion: kayaks do not belong among board surfers.

I dont think we are going to see Tom again somehow

Then there was the Eskimo who lit a fire in his kayak to keep warm. It caught fire, burnt and sank, he drowned.

Goes to prove ; You can't have your kayak and heat it too!

It's amazing how only Jaffa said that the surfer involved in the accident shouldn't have done what he did! And that he was damn stupid.
You are all worried about protecting surfers rights over the surf.
Yes kayak is dangerous and bla bla bla..
But why the hell the surfer didn't stop before getting too close the the kayaks and then told them the rules?
This is the same behaviour told in the other topic: as a beginner you have to disappear from my line or I'll run over you.
Surfboards have all the agility to avoid collision but still many surfers choose to have one in order to kick off beginners or other ocean users from the scene. This is amazingly crazy. And disgusting. Like shouting to a beginner girl in 40cm water because she was still and ruined a 200m ride causing collision at the amazing speed of 7kmh.. I've been witness of this. He didn't turn, he chosed collision.
Like this guy who chosed to collide with kayaks! You can tell whatever you want, but I will never share this approach. Luckily I didn't meet this sort of guy yet, or I've been cautious enough to not be in their way..