If this is real, then its amazing

[doublesand]

I read this article at www.productdose.com about this surfboard, and can't believe it. This would be really great for surfing if this thing is available.

[PapaW]

if you want it then be prepared to pay 3 times what you pay for a board at the moement...

[WaveJunkie]

I'm gonna jump on this one, without half reading the copy.

First off . . . according to most surf history/anthropology, the sport is about 2,000 yrs old. Not 3,000. But give or take a millenia . . . what the hell?

Boards went from solid wood, to hollow wood, to balsa and glass, to foam and glass.

We could go back to balsa and hemp fabric instead of glass, but the epoxy is not-bio-degradable, despite the balsa and hemp. Resin is forever, just like that glass bottle you're suckin' on.

I don't think boards are anywhere close to the landfill issue that are disposable diapers.

On the more huger (???) cosmic, ecological issue -- if it comes out of the ground and gets re-arranged . . . how does it change the huge picture ecologically?

Sooner or later humans are going to totally screw-up this planet and wipe themselves out as a species.

The planet doesn't care. The cosmos doesn't care. Why should we care? The world might be a more decent place without Hummers and cell-phones.

[RespectOurOcean]

Hey Mr. Jolly Roger Troll,
The only thing you got right was that you didn't read the story completely, because all your points are wrong.

First off, Polynesian culture dates back 3000 years, not 2000, and experts agree that they were riding paipo boards in the surf from the advent of their society. While there is no definitive answer as to when they started to stand upright on the boards, the spirit is the same. They didn't start using 3 pointers in the NBA until 1979, does that mean Basketball started only 26 years ago?

Polystyrene foam and fibreglass resin were both introduced to surfboards in the 1950's.

EVERYTHING on the board is biodegradable, INCLUDING the resin. When the board is over with you can toss it into a compost heap and return it to the Earth. Nothing is forever, not resin or glass bottles, but the styrofoam in a surfboard can last for thousands of years in a landfill. I think your sucking on a glass crack pipe when it comes to your opinions.

The boards ARE a bigger issue than diapers.Styrofoam is currently not recyclable because it is not cost effective enough for the powers that be. The last styrofoam recycling plant in the country was in L.A. and its been shut down.

When something comes out of the ground and gets rearranged, gets used, then returned to the Earth, that is called SUSTAINABLE LIVING. The picture is not changed ecologically, there is no damage done by our existence. AND THAT IS PRECISELY THE POINT. The goal is to only leave footprints on the sand and not leave trash.

Human beings are doomed sooner or later if they adopt your fatalistic and stupid point of view. People are working hard to prevent people with your foolish attitude from destroying the environment. The EcoBoard is a good example. I wholeheartedly disagree with you, human beings will prevail over our mistakes.

Regardless of whether or not the Earth and the Cosmos can or do care, we as people MUST care because it is our responsibility. Hummers and cell phones didn't create this mess, we did, and now we must fix it. What the world would be better off without is styrofoam and people with your ignorance.

[RespectOurOcean]

Papa Woolacombe,
Your right, it's going to be an expensive board when it comes out,and probably will cost 3 times more. But as the production process progresses the price will decrease and the technology and quality of the board will increase. I would much rather pay more money now for a board that doesn't destroy the environment than to have to pay with the higher consequences of global warming later.

[PapaW]

Fully agree... or you could just see the light and convert to sponging which uses only a 1/3 of materials that standup boards use ;)

Material conscious,
Space conscious
all round sweet ;)

[k mac]

QUE:........roy stewart

[WaveJunkie]

Hey Mr. Jolly Roger Troll,
The only thing you got right was that you didn't read the story completely, because all your points are wrong.

What the world would be better off without is styrofoam and people with your ignorance.

-- Jeez! *LMAO*

You bait the hook and troll it through the water, and you come up with fish!

Just for the record . . . I don't have a garbage service here because everything gets re-cycled. Oh sure, I'm not perfect. Now and then I buy something with obnoxious packaging that can't be re-cycled. But the packaging gets removed at the store and goes in their dumpster.

I have colleagues at the university working in fields of ecology. The principle ecological / economic (same Greek root, "eco" means "house") issue on the planet today is that humans are consuming resources at a level which can't be sustained.

It's gonna take a hell of a lot more than bio-degradable surf boards to turn it around.

Moreover, while there exist fiberglass resins which are bio-degradable, most of the currently used products are pretty much NOT degradable.

Finally, the cosmos doesn't care if humans "make it" or not. It's really ego-centric to think that it matters one way or the other.

[deathfrog]

I remember I accidently made a form of plastic out of corn starch once when trying to make bouncy balls, and then a few years later I saw stryofoam made otu of corn starch...

we're making progress.

[Roy Stewart]

I managed to contact the manufacturers of the resin used in the Eden Project board, hoping to get hold of some non toxic vegetable based resin. Unfortunatlely the resin used in the board is 50% Isocyanate which rules it out from my point of view because it is so toxic to work with, even after the resin has cured. The epoxy which we use has no icocyanate and is non toxic once cured so sanding dust isn't a problem. Apparently they are working on eliminating the isocyanate in the future.

Using petroleum products isn't the ideal solution but IMO if you build a board which lasts then it is justified.. . . disposable boards are a really bad idea.
If a board is designed to last for a very long time then it doesn't need to be biodegradable. The culture of breaking boards and then throwing them away is really silly. Russell Winter was quoted as saying that he uses 30 to 40 boards a year. . . .that's a horrendous waste of resources and sets a bad example. . . the idea that this is necessary to maintain surfing 'performance' is ludicrous.

Hemp cloth is nice but it is also possible to glass with cotton, silk, or linen.

[libby]

Have to agree with Wave Junkie. And before i'm called ignorant i'm currently studying ecology at uni. Its going to take a hell of a lot more than this to turn the world around, the big changes have to happen before the little ones make any difference. I guess its a nice token..a step in the right direction at best...but its sure as hell not going to save the world.

[k mac]

hearing you there roy ! some good poins made there

[Roy Stewart]

[quote](Libby)Have to agree with Wave Junkie. And before i'm called ignorant i'm currently studying ecology at uni. Its going to take a hell of a lot more than this to turn the world around, the big changes have to happen before the little ones make any difference. I guess its a nice token..a step in the right direction at best...but its sure as hell not going to save the world.[/quote]

Lots of little changes make one big change, isn't that obvious?

Ignoring the small things we can do to help just because they are small is very shortsighted IMO, environmentally friendly surfboards should be a goal for every surfer. . . at least they should be on the wish list.

BTW some of the stupidest people I have ever met were at 'Uni'. . . .and some of the smartest. . . . in other words just being enrolled at 'Uni' means sweet F all.

[libby]

I didnt mean that because i was at uni i was all seeing and all knowing, i meant that the fact that i was studying ecology meant i had an interest in it and was aware of some of the issues. I agree that the small changes add up to the big changes in some cases, hence my step in the right direction comments. I do however believe there are alot of token gestures out there to con people into believing a company/ a product is more environmentally friendly than it actually is, which is backed up by the research you did.

Have a wonderful day roy

[Brent]

Mind you, when you look at the mess it takes to craft one foam surfboard it is little compared to the damage done by driving to & from the surf repeatedly using a physically large, large fuel wasting, huge ecological footprint vehicle (like an ex public transport bus Roy). What does it do…9 miles to the gallon if that??? Why not just buy a Hummer & be done with it?

And likewise, being at University studying Ecology Roy is not a sign of intelligence no, but it is a sign of wanting to become educated in a way that is formally recognised, a sign of wanting to arm yourself with good professional research skills along with the existing empirical knowledge base to enable you jump into the lion's den professionally upon graduation and make a real difference - rather than just talking endlessly in theatres of little consequence.

I guess we all know stupid people at University; just like I know a healthy-ish still-living 70 year old woman who's smoked a packet of Rothmans every day of her adult life. It's really the exception rather than the norm isn't it?

[Roy Stewart]

[quote="Brent"][i]Mind you, when you look at the mess it takes to craft one foam surfboard it is little compared to the damage done by driving to & from the surf repeatedly using a physically large, large fuel wasting, huge ecological footprint vehicle [/i][/quote]

By transporting 12 people in that bus we are probably no less efficient than people driving vehicles on their own. . . . the bus runs an economical Isuzu Diesel and uses the same amount of fuel as my CF Bedford van used to.

Once again you are using the spurious but commonly used argument that unless one is ecologically perfect in all aspects of one's life then one shouldn't bother trying to make surfboards which are environmentally friendly.

I suggest tht it is sensible to try and use whatever environmentally friendly alternatives are available.

[quote[i]]And likewise, being at University studying Ecology Roy is not a sign of intelligence no[/i][/quote]

I am so glad that you agree.

[Roy Stewart]

My main point here was that the resin used in the Eden Project board contains 50% Isocyanate which is very toxic to work with even after the resin has cured.

I would thus prefer to use epoxy resin from Gemco in Mount Maunganui, which contains no Isocyanate.

This is a personal decision relating to my own health.

[libby]

Hi Roy

I have no idea what i did to deserve the insults but ignoring that.....

In many ways i have alot of respect for how you choose to lead you life i.e. avoiding using dangerous/toxic/environmentally unfriendly chemicals in favour of natural ones and the fact that you do not fell trees soley for the purposes of making your boards unless there is no other alternative and in which case you use wood from a sustainable source.

If everyone made these changes then i agree yes it would add up to a big change. But i would not decribe these changes as small. For society as a whole (or a substantial proportion of) to make these changes would take a MASSIVE change in peoples attitudes. For example i am directly interested in ecology (whatever that does or does not say about me - its just an example) and I do not generally activley seek out naturally made products. So how are we supposed to make people (probably the majority) who do not genuinley give a sh*t change their habits? I do not call this a small change.

I also do not like token gestures, such as people who refuse to buy proctor and gamble products, yet do not bother to check out if the alternatives are any more environmentally/ socially friendly. These are hollow and in my opinion, done soley for there own concience not any wider benefit.

This is the justification for my "small changes wont make a huge difference" comments, which i stand by. I believe people will not make the changes to their lives until they are forced too, and by that i mean there are stonger laws in place monitering the chemicals used in products, the chemicals pumped into the atmosphere and the sea and such things. People in general dont care Roy (again in my opinion and experience) and the way you lead your life is the exception rather than the rule.

I was not criticising you in anyway, and dont wish to get drawn in to any name calling that has happened on this site before, its not really my thing.

I'm not sure how clear i have made myself, i have not sat long and hard about this, too many essays but if you want further justification for my beliefs then i will be happy to try and make myself a bit clearer in a week or so in the mid semester break.

[libby]

Ps there are a couple of papers i think you would enjoy, probably available on google scholar by J. Cairns Jr, the first is titled " Balancing Ecological Destruction and Restoration: the only hope for sustainable use of the planet? In Aquatic Ecosytem Health and Managment (2) 1999 91-95

and another "setting ecological restoration goals for technical feasability and scientific validity" Its a guest editorial in Ecological Engineering 15 (2000) 171-180

Both semi relevant to my points.

[Roy Stewart]

Hi Libby,
it's clear that you are giving these things some thought and are an active student of ecology.

If you look at my posts again you will see that I have not insulted you at all, I merely suggested that being enrolled in ecology courses is not in itself proof of intelligence, and I said this in response to your assertion that "before you call me ignorant realise that I am studying ecology at Uni" or words to that effect.

Thanksfor the links.