Wanting to start on a shortboard?

[kyleisanoob12]

I know it's not ideal for beginners, but I'm 5'5 125 lbs and 16 years old, and want to learn how to ride a shortboard. I like riding longboards too, but I want to try shortboards. I can switch on and off between the two if a shortboard gets too frustrating, as many say. If I wanted to try a shortboard for the heck of it, could anyone recommend dimensions? I know it's certainly not ideal for beginners to buy their own boards especially since they don't know what the want, but what do you guys think about the CI New Flyer (5'5 - 18 3/8 - 2 3/16 - 22.8L)? What would be the best dimensions for waves in the San Diego/Encinitas area? More specifically, more beginner-like areas such as Beacon's or Carlsbad (surfed there before). Surfline averages the waves at 2-3+ ft and says knee high to a few feet overhead. I usually go in when the tide gets too high.

[kookextraordinaire]

Hey man,

I don't think the Flyer (especially the new flyer) is great for a starter surfboard, and although it is marketed as a "small-wave" shortboard. I don't think can really get going in 3ft waves unless the rider really knows how to work the face.

If you plan to switch on and off, then there is going to be a bit of a shock each time if your shortboard is under 19".

My recommendation would be a sightly oversized thruster, at least 20" wide and over 6'1" and pretty thick, 2.5" plus. At 16 I assume you are still growing so you will need something with a bit more float as you grow into it.

I think whichever board you get you should be looking for these specifications along with chunkier dims: a nice deep single concave under the front-foot going out to a double concave between the fins. This will make for a fast board with a nice easy to turn setup. A vee after the double concave would work too. A nice full beaked nose and wide tail would be good for added push. You are going to want low entry rocker and not too much tail rocker.

That said don't get caught up too much in the numbers, brands or put too much stock in volume calculators. See if you can demo boards. GO second-hand. And, get as many opinions as possible, I could be way off, this is just what worked for me in small waves.

The flyer F is a classic if you can find it.

[kyleisanoob12]

Hey man,

I don't think the Flyer (especially the new flyer) is great for a starter surfboard, and although it is marketed as a "small-wave" shortboard. I don't think can really get going in 3ft waves unless the rider really knows how to work the face.

If you plan to switch on and off, then there is going to be a bit of a shock each time if your shortboard is under 19".

My recommendation would be a sightly oversized thruster, at least 20" wide and over 6'1" and pretty thick, 2.5" plus. At 16 I assume you are still growing so you will need something with a bit more float as you grow into it.

I think whichever board you get you should be looking for these specifications along with chunkier dims: a nice deep single concave under the front-foot going out to a double concave between the fins. This will make for a fast board with a nice easy to turn setup. A vee after the double concave would work too. A nice full beaked nose and wide tail would be good for added push. You are going to want low entry rocker and not too much tail rocker.

That said don't get caught up too much in the numbers, brands or put too much stock in volume calculators. See if you can demo boards. GO second-hand. And, get as many opinions as possible, I could be way off, this is just what worked for me in small waves.

The flyer F is a classic if you can find it.

This was very informative, thank you! Most people just call me stupid for wanting to start on a shortboard, which I know it is, but you didn't say anything so I'll definitely look into some other boards, thanks!

[RinkyDink]

I know it's certainly not ideal for beginners to buy their own boards especially since they don't know what the want, but what do you guys think about the CI New Flyer (5'5 - 18 3/8 - 2 3/16 - 22.8L)? What would be the best dimensions for waves in the San Diego/Encinitas area? More specifically, more beginner-like areas such as Beacon's or Carlsbad (surfed there before). Surfline averages the waves at 2-3+ ft and says knee high to a few feet overhead. I usually go in when the tide gets too high.

If I want to buy a Toyota Corolla and drive it in sand dunes occasionally (I know 4 wheel drives rather than Corollas are more suited for driving in sand dunes, but so what . . .), can you recommend a sand dune in the San Diego area that a Corolla can kind of handle?

[waikikikichan]

Yes, it would be unwise to start on Shortboard..... BUT you have been riding longboards for awhile. I don't see anything wrong with trying to Shortboard. To go out and spend money on a size/shape you're not sure of is not so smart. I know you asking for recommendation so you don't buy the " wrong" board, but there really is no "one" board. YOU have to try many boards. You seemed to have figured out on a 5'5", we'll go borrow or demo that. Only you can figure if you like it or not.
But I do agree 18 1/2" is too narrow. 19"+ is better.

[kookextraordinaire]

I think the above advice is a better than mine. The dims which work for me won't work for a different surfer. Just try lots of boards.

But, at 5'5", I'm guessing your stance is pretty narrow which is something to consider. I'm 6' tall so longer boards with a forward wide point tend to work better for me.

Does anybody on this site find a correlation between forward wide points on boards and stance width?

[Big H]

Does anybody on this site find a correlation between forward wide points on boards and stance width?

What does that mean?

[Big H]

Do you mean that if a board has a forward wide point you need a wider than normal stance? Or that a person should surf a board with that kind of design shorter than their height so that they can get that lead foot up far enough to ride in balance with the back foot on the tail pad?

[kookextraordinaire]

I prefer boards with the widest part slightly forward. Boards with a wider forward point paddle better, but I find that a wider stance (not drastically wider) accommodates this design better. I was wondering if other people have this experience.

Here's a pretty good example, my board is similar to this design: http://www.robertssurf.com/wd3.html

Generally (and correct me if I'm wrong), the sweet spot is around the widest part of the shortboard. If kyle (at 5'5") surfed my board, which is a 5'11", his front foot would be a bit far back. So he would need a board with the sweet spot for his front foot relative to his stance width. To use a more extreme example, imagine if the board was 6'6". The back foot placement is the same but he probably wouldn't be able to reach with his front foot. Front foot placement is just as important as the back foot, although if you watch pros they shift around a lot. I don't, but then again I'm not a great surfer.

So a good board for kyle wouldn't necessarily shorter, but appropriately proportioned. But this is straying into custom territory. I'm sure there are lots of other factors which determine ideal front foot placement.

Again, I might be pretty off with this.

[dtc]

aah, yes - but then have a read of Geoff McCoy's views on surfboard shapes. He is a famous shaper and all of his boards have the wide point in the tail. His view is that most (not all) people actually weight their back foot/rely on their back foot much more. The front foot merely guides.

http://www.mccoysurfboards.com/mccoy-philosophy

[kyleisanoob12]

Yes, it would be unwise to start on Shortboard..... BUT you have been riding longboards for awhile. I don't see anything wrong with trying to Shortboard. To go out and spend money on a size/shape you're not sure of is not so smart. I know you asking for recommendation so you don't buy the " wrong" board, but there really is no "one" board. YOU have to try many boards. You seemed to have figured out on a 5'5", we'll go borrow or demo that. Only you can figure if you like it or not.
But I do agree 18 1/2" is too narrow. 19"+ is better.

Awesome! I should probably demo boards before dropping $500+. Thanks!

[kookextraordinaire]

Agreed, the back foot manipulates the fins which turn the board. Mark Richards says the same thing as Mcoy: http://markrichardssurfboards.com/blog/ ... -pressure/

But the front foot engages the planing surface of the board when pumping or trimming. I don't think there is such thing as a "back-footed" or "font-footed" surfer, as Richards states. You need both legs to surf. Surfing, I think, is the subtle dance of shifting pressure between the two. I read that on this site somewhere.

However, I don't think the wide point of the board can be "in the tail". That would look very strange, like a triangle. Surely you mean closer to the tail?

[oldmansurfer]

I am not sure about others but on occasions I put lots of pressure on my front foot however it is probably equal to my back foot and not more. This would be when turning powerful turns but I use my back foot way more for less powerful stuff

[waikikikichan]

Does anybody on this site find a correlation between forward wide points on boards and stance width?

What does that mean?

Think of riding a surfboard as more turning a Motorcycle versus steering a car. A car turns flat, a motorcycle turns and leans. There is some body sway in a car as it goes left to right, but not the same as a motorcycle as it transfers from one side profile of the tire to the other side. That tire profile effects the "turn in" and the effort to turn. A ROUNDER profiled tire smoothly rolls over. A more Triangle profile tire "falls" over more easily, but harder to bring upright. Some racers like the triangle profile cause it keeps them leaned over in the turns, but some people like me don't like the effort it takes to transfer left to right. That outline ( profile ) with wide point forward or back on a surfboard, effects how the surfboard turns, rolls from inside rail to outside rail, and how much effort it takes. And just like Wide handle bars give more leverage to turn a bike, a wide stance may feel more stable on a surfboard. But wide handle bars engage more the shoulder, narrow handle bars more the wrist and minor movements. It up to a motorcycle rider and surfer how wide or narrow he feels that width should be. (Ape Hanger bars and poo stance always look strange to me.)

[dtc]

However, I don't think the wide point of the board can be "in the tail". That would look very strange, like a triangle. Surely you mean closer to the tail?

Not quite 'in the tail' but quite far back (although there are some slightly different models). Keep in mind that they are also over 3 inches thick and that thickness goes pretty much back to the tail, but the nose is more refined (and a fair bit of rocker). Anyway, its a different approach and many dont agree with McCoy or like his designs. Others are disciples

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[oldmansurfer]

I think the front foot surfer as far as I can tell is just one who puts more pressure on their front leg when in trim. I only put more pressure on my front foot temporarily to gain speed so when I am in trim I stand fairly equal pressure unless I want to turn or gain speed.