Foamie to Groveler transition, bad idea?

[MarkMorrison]

Hey I’m looking for some board advice.

I’ve been surfing for 3 years pretty casually (1x a week/weekend warrior). Average fitness, 5’10, 140. For the first year, I rented epoxy boards that were anywhere from 7’6 to 8’6. When it was time to buy my first board, I went on Craigslist and bought a 6’0 performance short board because I thought it was cool and I had no clue what I was doing. Obviously that didn’t work out for me, so I grabbed myself an 8ft foamie. This is the board that I learned the majority of my skills on. At this point, I wouldn’t say I’m a beginner, but maybe closer to an intermediate. My positioning is pretty good, paddling could better, wave selection is decent, I’m able to surf lefts and rights, cut back on the face (albeit slowly on the 8ft), and do some dancing/walk the nose. I stepped down to a 7ft foamie in the hopes that it would be a little bit more maneuverable, but frankly it still feels unresponsive. I’m not sure I’ve got enough meat on my legs to really drive that much foam. I used to skateboard almost every day for 5-6 years, something that I think helped me a lot when dialing in my surfing, but that’s also why I’m seeking a step down again, to get to that verty feeling.

Where I’m from we mostly get 2-4ft swell, almost all sand bars with a couple good point breaks. With my work schedule, I’m largely at the mercy of the weekend waves, which in the summer is often mush.

Things I acknowledge:
-Even just going from a 7ft softie to a 7ft epoxy would be a significant reduction in foam, would likely make it slightly harder to paddle but more responsive.
-Grovelers are designed for specific conditions and are meant to be ridden short.
-There’s probably more things I could learn to do on a longboard, but that surfing style isn’t super fun or appealing to me.

With all that said, I’m looking to step down to a board that will give me the ability to surf skatey in small waves. I’d like to keep some extra foam under me to help with the mush and give me a boost in paddling. I’ve landed on a couple boards, neither of which are available to demo in my area.
The first is the Baked Potato in a 5’5 or 5’7.
The second is the Greedy Beaver in a 6’2 or 6’4.
These are very different surfboards but I feel like I could make either of them work in the 40L range, leaning more towards the Baked Potato because it seems like it has a higher skill ceiling than the Greedy Beaver, meaning I’d get some extra utility out of it.

If anyone has some guidance or input on my situation and either of these Firewire boards, I’d really appreciate it.
Thanks!

[jaffa1949]

The title of your thread says it all.
Lose paddling power your wave count on the weekend will drop dramatically.
I hear you want the vertical feeling, hmmm good surfers can go vertical on longer boards.
It is really about , grovellers work by the rider being able to push for drive by going rail to rail, using their turns to generate speed.
Add to this mushy surf you really need to be able to gain power in the little pockets, a little more length helps there.
Don’t believe your scrawny leg muscle are the problem, positioning, helps greatly1
There is quite a lot to learn on what you have.

Notice I haven’t mentioned volume , potatoes or beavers, both boards are dogs at your skill level, see if other boards are around of similar size that you can test.. see,if what I am suggesting is true!

[steveylang]

Going from a 7' foamy to a sub-6' groveler is about 2-3 steps forward too many for most people. I mean if you found say a great deal on CL for a short groveler style board and wanted to give it a go, I'm all for that kind of thing. I think a hard board is a good next step, but not nearly that small.

You want to be on as big a board as needed that will give you a good wave count, and stable enough for you to be able to learn to work the board and carve (probably a funboard shape around 7' to 7'+.) Being able to carve is less about the length of the board or your leg strength, than your positioning on the board and skill:

http://alohaki.jugem.jp/?eid=688

Now question for you:

Do baseball batters warm up with a lighter bat or heavier bat ?
To get stronger muscles do you lift lighter weights or heavier weights ?

And that is the secret if you can't turn a 7'0" board, ride a BIGGER board NOT a smaller board.
If you ride a bigger board everyday for 2 weeks, when you get back on your shorter board, it THEN will be easier.

Don't go shorter, go longer. Ask your friend if you can borrow their unused longboard or 8'0" funboard for bit. Then after you can turn that bigger board, you'll probably have no problem turning your current 7'0".

[alex_k]

I swapped from a standard costco wavestorm and was considering, among other things, the greedy beaver. I ended up buying an 8'2", 57L mini performance longboard and it was a *giant* step in terms of performance and turning ability. The nose and tail are much thinner than a standard mini longboard, and somewhat less wide. It likes to be surfed with a turning style, not a set-your-line-and-walk style, and shines when waves get chest high to a little overhead.

A few months in to owning that, I rented a 6'6" greedy beaver out of curiosity. It was pretty easy to get waves on it at my local beach break, but is pretty unstable, felt like surfing on a block of ice in the first session. It felt harder to make a steeper drop on in a punchy wave than on the longboard. My conclusion was that there was nothing in the board that would encourage or allow me to surf better at the moment. I've never ridden a real groveler with a super wide tail, but this board seems like a short board tail pasted onto a very wide nose and thus pretty different.

From my experience, it is is notably easier to surf with more length, not just with more volume. There are a large variety of mid-lengths, eggs and their cousins speed eggs, performance mini-mals that work with a turn-oriented style of surfing, and are designed for a variety of conditions, not just small waves unsuitable for a performance shortboard.

That's just what I found, hope it's informative.

[waikikikichan]

My 3 cents on the subject:

1) Forget about volume. To get the same volume but shorter, they make the rail boxy fat and tail ( or some other part ) super wide. Most beginner-intermediates don't have the skill set yet to control and drive the rail. ( especially when the whitewater hits and throws you off if you can't engage the rail properly
2) Don't go shorter until you go harder. At least be fully confident on a 7'2"- 7'6" Fun board that's made from PU/Poly ( or even better molded-epoxy, since you might be used to bumping your softboard into things with no worries ) before moving down to a 6'6".
3) If you want a more "skatey" feel, take off the center fin on your sponge board. The limiting factor for most sponges is the flex and delayed response of the rubber fin(s).

But hey, longboarding not cool right and not fun ? So go get that wizz-bang cool Grovelor. If it doesn't work out, keep it in the storage until you're ready for it. By the way, where did you put that 6'0" ?

Question: Are you kicking out of the wave consistently on your feet the majority of the time ?