buying used: mass produced vs hand shaped

[garek007]

Hi guys,

So I'm in the market for a board in the 7'2" - 7'10" range and I'm shopping mostly on craigslist. What I was hoping to do was find a screaming deal on a good board for around 200, but deals like that are few and far between and when they do pop up, they go fast. So I'm willing to spend more now, maybe up to 300, but I want something nice. I want it to be relatively new with not too many repairs.

One thing I keep seeing is eggs that come up from brands I've never heard. Most of the time, when I google this brand I find out it's most likely mass produced somewhere. I usually find plenty of bashing on those brands too.

I get that if I'm buying new I should of course go to a shaper over buying a pop out, you know shop local, support the craft, etc. yadda yadda. But if I'm buying a used board, then all that goes out the window and now it comes down to which mass produced models ride well? Surely there are some out there that ride well (obviously not NSP).

Can someone list a few that are ok?

Also, on a shape as traditional as the egg, how badly can companies like Global Surf Industries screw up? Isn't it pretty straightforward?

[dtc]

There is no definitive line you can draw. Nowadays most mass produced boards have a reasonable shape, because CAD design and machining makes it pretty easy - you can buy a design from a shaper and just feed it into the machine. Often they are basic shapes (you wont find a mass produced bonzer or channel board) but are good enough for beginners and most intermediates - may not be 'great' but 'good enough'

The issue with mass produced boards is mostly quality control - things not lining up, just not put together very well, fin boxes out of alignment, poor paint job and things like that. Many boards are produced by the same factory and given different names; the QC may or may not be very good (few in the factories will surf, that is for sure, so how do they learn what is not right?). On the other hand, a machine made board with good QC will have a pretty good chance of being a good board - machines minimise errors. Firewire is a factory produced board, for example, at a high quality (it appears). So are a lot of Hayden Shapes (the hypto krypto) On the other hand, there are companies who import a crate of boards from Thailand or wherever, slap a label on them and claim all sorts of things.

Hand made boards can be terrible as well, some individual making 40 boards a year with no real expertise short changing on the glassing or making a mistake shaping a rail or locating a fin box as well. Dont think all shapers are the same - anything made by hand can be bad as well as good (as you will know if you have seen my woodwork efforts)

So whats the answer? Well, as you suggest, there is less risk in buying a board made by a bigger company. There is less risk in buying a board from a shaper with a good reputation (if you can find out that kind of thing). But a board in good condition from a no name is still likely a better buy than a board in bad condition from a big name. At $200 - $300, you really have to look at the condition of the board first rather than the maker, then the shape etc (ie the board is the type of board you want). Then maybe the maker/shaper at the end of the day.

If you buy something in good condition, as you are after, it wont fall apart in a month. If you surf it and its a dog, just sell it onto the next person and try another one.

[garek007]

Hey thanks! That is really helpful. The last board I got shaped from Robin Pradonovich. I'm REALLY happy with that board and will definitely go back to him, I just wasn't ready to shell out $600 on this. He has a good rep I think, he was featured in Shaper's alley on surfline. Anywho, the way you describe it is helpful. I've worked in companies that are just trying to turn a profit and they can shell out some pretty crappy stuff. Maybe I'll just go to the shaper. Curious though, aren't Lost boards mass produced? If not, how can they be everywhere?

[garek007]

Just saw this, are Amundson good?

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/csd/spo/5643863418.html

[drowningbitbybit]

Curious though, aren't Lost boards mass produced?

Yes. Most of the boards you see on the rack in a branded surf shop these days will be mass produced. That's right kids, Al Merrick didn't actually shape your board, it's just an Al Merrick design

A mass produced board from a top-end manufacturer (Lost, Al Merrick, basically most of the ones you've heard of) will be as good quality as a custom board, it just won't have been made for you

So if buying secondhand, it makes no difference whether it's mass-produced or a custom if the board is the right dimensions.

[dtc]

Just saw this, are Amundson good?

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/csd/spo/5643863418.html

No idea about Amundson; but anyone who survives as a shaper in Hawaii for as long as he has probably is pretty good.

More importantly: does the board suit you? It looks in good condition but its pretty narrow for a 7ft6 (21 1/8) so its more a 'fun gun' or funboard than a mini mal - not that this is bad, but is it what you want? Cant tell the rocker from the photos but looks pretty flat.

Personally I would prefer a fin box in the centre to allow you to move the fin around or even go single, but its not a deal killer by any means.

[garek007]

What would moving the fin around do for me? I was going to go with a standard thruster, but should I go with a 2+1?

[dtc]

a fin box just gives you some ability to vary the ride through moving the fin back and forward; it also allows you to use a single fin if thats your thing. But its no big deal; I wouldnt worry about it. You can do a 'cheater' 2+1 with a thruster set up anyway, by buying a large centre fin (5 or 6 inch I think you can get) and putting some small (2-3 inch) side fins.

However, really, dont worry about it. A thruster set up will be totally fin and, as mentioned, you can still play around with fin sizes if you want

[waikikikichan]

now it comes down to which mass produced models ride well? Surely there are some out there that ride well (obviously not NSP). Can someone list a few that are ok?

To me NSP board ride fine and adequate enough for Newbies all the way up to the Average surfer. They are made fuller/thicker to make it easier to catch waves and have a more stable ride. They're designed to get the maximum fun at a good price, yet are more durable. I see nothing wrong about that. Since you are a advanced above average surfer, maybe your needs might differ. But molded epoxy boards like NSP, Surftech, Torq and BICs fill a need in this industry.

aIMG_8772 2 copy.JPG (211.57 KiB) Viewed 1912 times

This is a 6'4" NSP Fish that I won 2 contest on. This is even before they added the FCS fins systems on to them. I still have this board. It's over 10 years old. Not one ding.

[waikikikichan]

What I was hoping to do was find a screaming deal on a good board for around 200, but deals like that are few and far between and when they do pop up, they go fast. So I'm willing to spend more now, maybe up to 300, but I want something nice. I want it to be relatively new with not too many repairs.

The last board I got shaped from Robin Pradonovich. I'm REALLY happy with that board and will definitely go back to him, I just wasn't ready to shell out $600 on this.

Because I ride Molded-Epoxy ( pop-outs ) you might think I'm against custom hand shapes. Actually quite the opposite. I have utmost respect for the real shapers ( not the CAD scrubbers ). They are true artisans, but don't get paid as such. Take for instance a custom made cabinet or table versus one bought at IKEA. $100's if not $1000 difference in price. That custom board from your shaper, which takes over 70 steps to make, should be more than $600.

I also work in a Bicycle shop and get the "Want the good, but don't want to pay a lot" customers all the time. I show them the $600 bike with a solid frame and good components. They say "Well, it's made in China, don't you have anything made in the U.S. ?". I then show them the $2500 made in the U.S. bike and they freak on the price. A true custom frame built by hand is way over $1500 just for the frame alone.

Will the "made in China" bike get you down the hill or across town ? Sure it will. I know guys that smoke me down the hill on a Walmart bike. It's all they can afford.

Here's a bit of advice which pertains to both Surfboards and Bikes. LIGHT, STRONG, CHEAP. Choose TWO out of the THREE.