What would you call this tail shape?

[Big H]

Curious....never seen anything like this. Board is a MB Michael Baron Handshape 7' step up. Anyone have a name for this and a why behind the shape?

From the little I know, I'd guess the design was to extend the rail line similar to a baby swallow, only instead of removing the bit in the middle, the pin tail will help to hold in steep surf...longer rail will help a little with stability making for a fast, down the line bigger wave board....kind of like a steering damper for a sport bike. Just guessing....please correct me; I'm curious.

Any ideas?

[dtc]

What would I call it? Experimental!

[waikikikichan]

Wing Pin or Step Pin. Wing Pin similar to a wing-swallow but just comes down to a point. Step Pin in that there's a wide hip and a literal step down ( like a stairs ) to the next level.

[Big H]

Thanks!

Now the question; why shape a tail like that rather than as a more traditional pin or swallow? What is the shaper trying to achieve?

[oldmansurfer]

The narrower tail would be better for carving and steep waves and the wider in front improves paddling and planing

[Big H]

I read a little about tail design from two articles I found googling that seemed to be pretty good, not just the usual overview, in this one there is a shape Rusty P. calls a Toad tail which is a lot less pronounced than this one but somewhat similar.

http://www.surfline.com/blogs/talking-d ... ash_30118/


There was this article as well that was interesting:
https://essentialsurfing.com/tails/

From the article:
Wings, bump wings, and stingers are shifts in the template that alter the rail line. They vary in placement, as well as in how pronounced they are. The shaper can use them with any rail design to set up a break/pivot point in the rail line that will loosen the board’s turning characteristic.

[jaffa1949]

You may remember the Bonzer kneeboard i designed . It had slightly more subtle wings or stingers where the single to double concaves emerge to the rails near the tail. The idea is to give an enhance fulcrum turning point and the concaves allow immediate acceleration out of a strong turn!

The concaves and connection to the stingers are more evident here

The board is fast enough to run under the white water after a late drop and reach the power pocket from behind at the Bar ( my home break)
Have only had one wave of quality on it so far, first surfs were with the smaller Bonzer FCS fins and the board was too squirrelly , reacting to even the slightest weight change in any direction. ( not necessarily beneficial), the larger fins and a change of position back with the centre fins enable a solid bottom turn and connecting to a full volume top turn repeated in sequence for the full 300 yards of wave.
The board sat well at the critical power point in the pocket, so I think I have a keeper

[Big H]

Looking at the location of the fin boxes in relation to the rail line and keeping what Rusty P. said in mind about the toad tail shape evolving from twinzers, it could be the bottom contours favour a four fin quad setup and the design of the rail and tail compliments that.

I don't pretend to know much about this; I am curious when I see something like this because it would appear to be more than just whimsy.

[jaffa1949]

No I designed it with a critical plan for the Bonzers 3 fin set up and planing surfaces between the rails and the concaves, I ave had this variant in my head ever since I first saw the Bonzers,
I had a dimple bottom board way 1985ish using the principles of the dimples on a golf ball went really well but was a drag to shape and even worse to glass. Channel bottoms went a similar way as later shapers hated doing them.
There were hexagonal rails but they jerked across each change in rail profile as you powered a turn, Failure!! John Kelly had a step bottom board the Hydro bottom!. Retro smetro so much has moved on and the average surfer has become a lot more skilled on the designs of today.
Understandably so if you can get on a proper old log with very little rocker and a single D fin.
you will understand how much boards have advanced to enhance thing for us.
Could say more but a rant lies somewhere in there.

[Big H]

I was talking about the MB board.

[oldmansurfer]

Lots of surfers are resistant to changes. They like what they feel comfortable with. Any new thing is likely a gimmick anyway so they don't bother checking out every design. I think lots of designs work in some manner but no big deal over all. That particular design looks like something I might like because it allows a narrow tail with lots of flotation.

[jaffa1949]

I was talking about the MB board.

OH nice board for your favourite spots big H

[waikikikichan]

What is the shaper trying to achieve?

Like what every other shaper is trying to achieve............. The IMPOSSIBLE. A board that's :
1) fast yet loose.
2) paddles easy and easy to turn.
3) strong yet light.
4) good in ankle high to 3x overhead.
5) floats like a butterfly, stings like a bee.

There's so many tail designs. They come and go ( and come again ). But notice how rare that wing-pin tail is. Seems strange for physics to have a streamlined point at the end, but a turbulent blunt corner ahead of it.
The sad thing is a lot of those "experimental" tail designs had glassed-on fins. With today's fins, they could've made them work better.

[Big H]

No I designed it with a critical plan for the Bonzers 3 fin set up and planing surfaces between the rails and the concaves, I ave had this variant in my head ever since I first saw the Bonzers,
I had a dimple bottom board way 1985ish using the principles of the dimples on a golf ball went really well but was a drag to shape and even worse to glass. Channel bottoms went a similar way as later shapers hated doing them.
There were hexagonal rails but they jerked across each change in rail profile as you powered a turn, Failure!! John Kelly had a step bottom board the Hydro bottom!. Retro smetro so much has moved on and the average surfer has become a lot more skilled on the designs of today.
Understandably so if you can get on a proper old log with very little rocker and a single D fin.
you will understand how much boards have advanced to enhance thing for us.
Could say more but a rant lies somewhere in there.

There appears to be a wedge of wood between the stringers....is that wood and what is that for; to stabilise the stringers via wedged tension?

[Big H]

What is the shaper trying to achieve?

Like what every other shaper is trying to achieve............. The IMPOSSIBLE. A board that's :
1) fast yet loose.
2) paddles easy and easy to turn.
3) strong yet light.
4) good in ankle high to 3x overhead.
5) floats like a butterfly, stings like a bee.

There's so many tail designs. They come and go ( and come again ). But notice how rare that wing-pin tail is. Seems strange for physics to have a streamlined point at the end, but a turbulent blunt corner ahead of it.
The sad thing is a lot of those "experimental" tail designs had glassed-on fins. With today's fins, they could've made them work better.

Yeah....probably just bored and wanted to try something new.....in the end I'm not good enough to exploit much of whatever attributes/differences that might be in the design. Solid board, pintail, my size, was a steal, good step up for the season around the corner. Once we get some swell I'll see how it behaves.

[Big H]

Something similar from Webber....

https://gwwaves.wordpress.com/models/creature/

[waikikikichan]

i would hate to see what happens when you do a "Chicken Wing" pop up on that thing. Probably gets a skewered Thigh.

[Big H]

i would hate to see what happens when you do a "Chicken Wing" pop up on that thing. Probably gets a skewered Thigh.

Definitely designed to take an eye out.....

[icetime]

I've heard people calling these bat tails, they're not that common so they don't have a universal name from what I can tell

[Big H]

As I understand it, this is a bat tail.