Need help buying 2nd board

[TJ1984]

Hello all. I realize this same advice has been asked for many times and ive done my best to search out what i can find but still need help. My background is surfing 4-5 times a week(3 hour sessions) for about 7 months at various breaks some beach, some cobblestone and some reef. The conditions here vary alot. I bought my first board used, A 9 ft longboard which I can now catch most waves I paddle for but in steeper head high stuff I nose dive alot. I can now ride and turn left and right breaks to shore on clean days. My biggest issue is paddling out on bigger days as I do my best to turtle roll but I want a board with more manuverability and the ability to start duck diving. My end goal is to be riding a shortboard but overall just continue to enjoy surfing and keep improving. I am 6'1 190lbs and in good shape. I went to a local shaper who has seen me surf a bit and he told me that my board was way too big for me and he suggested a funboard or a fish/hybrid first before shelling out money for a custom board. He suggested a board from 6'2-7'2 in length, over 21 inch wide and over 2 and 3/8 thick. I was looking at a firewire addvance or a modern blackfish or 7S superfish but cannot get them here and shipping overseas is more than the board itself and defeats the purpose. My 2 choices are a 7'2 Torq popout funboard (47 litres or a Santa Cruz Pumpkin seed. Does anyone know anything about Torq? I cant find much except they are based out of Australia maybe made in SE asia? I really have my eye on this Pumpkin seed because I feel it maybe a little harder to get used to but would last me longer and I could continue to progress on it longer than the Torq and I would continue to use it later on. For the pumpkin seed there is a 7'6 (47 litres) and a 7'0 (41 litres). Again I know the 7'0 will be more of a challenge but I may use it longer before getting another board but I also dont want to jump down sizes too quick and get a board that doesnt match my ability. The best would be to demo the 2 but I am also ordering these online but not from overseas as Im in a really remote spot and demo isnt really possible. I have tried a 7'6 mini mal before which was ok but totally different. Any advice or tips would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers

[Big H]

Some questions:
-Where are you located?
-Is getting a used board an option?
-How old are you?
-Why not throw the local shaper who gave you the advice some business and let him shape a board for you?

I live in Bali, am in the process of learning to surf and have started on a longboard before going shorter for manageability, survivability in bigger stuff.....but I can ride it in steep overhead waves; getting in early is the key as is angling so you're not taking a straight drop. I also figured out how to get out back at breaks I thought were impossible to do so on heavy days when I was first starting out. I enjoy short boarding....not any good yet but working on it....but I have to say that looking back the whole getting a shortboard so that you can duck dive to get out back is the wrong reason as is nosediving on head high waves. Stick with the longboard just a bit longer, learn to get out back on heavy days and make steeper, late angled drops as well as early entry paddle like hell angled glide ins as well as learning how to deal with being stuck inside with a big board on a heavy day and you'll really benefit; you'll have to become more clever and study the break and rhythms to be able to get out back on those big days, develop stamina and tricks to deal with being stuck inside, and become more aware about nuances of take offs FASTER by practicing more critical drops on an easy to ride board. With your frequency and with ocean swell cooperation, a few months should do it.
-Have you ever tried epoxy boards? If no can you rent one and test it out before committing to buying a new board?


Outside that, there are a lot of guys big on the torq here. I would go 7'6" for whatever you choose, then 7'. Getting used to a board that doesn't glide is a whole different ball game and your paddle fitness is going to strain even if you think it's good now. Get a board that makes you happy; that's what this is all about, but don't bite off more than can be relatively easily chewed. Getting used to a smaller board translates into a lot more time hung up at certain stages of development, and the problem with a 7'6" epoxy board vs a 7' is that NEITHER will duck dive worth a damn even for your size (same as me basically) when you really need it (1.5OH wave about to break on your neck) so unless you go ahead and drop down to a 35L board I would say that the duck diving benefits of a smaller board will be negligible whereas the loss in paddle speed will be really noticeable....the way you used to be able to race out back between waves on a longboard will be lost, and those tweener sizes can't really be ducked that well (duck dips more than anything) so at 7' you're on a board that won't really duck, doesn't paddle that fast and is consequently going to make getting out back on a bigger day even harder as you can't race by and can't go under. So for the tweener at your size, I'd go 7'6", ride the heck out of it, then go to a 35-37ish L volume that can be ducked deep enough to count and still has float enough for your big body. A mini mal or fun board isn't going to offer any revelations RE not nosediving on head high waves...you have to angle, and it's easier to learn how to do it FAST on a longboard, then transfer that knowledge to a smaller board....plus you'll get a split second extra time on the long board to get it together.

Hope this helps. I've tried ALOT of boards; so many used here and they can be bought and sold for no loss so I just try and if it works I keep it and use it for awhile....I figured out what volume through trial and error....otherwise I sell it on.

Cheers!

[Big H]

I bought a board similar to those tweener sizes, a 7'8"x21x3" board that is a single fin. Rails are relatively low and the tail it thinned out as well so it's not a fun board though it has a lot of volume. I really like that board and have no plans to sell it; it is not a transition board or one that I will grow out of or "graduate" from as I hear a lot of people say about their former rides around here. Maybe think about something like that, or better yet just get a 7'something fun board/mini mal shape and keep at it; things that you used to be able to do easily on the 9' will be challenging again on the 7'6" and it will take time to work that out. Enjoy the journey.

[Big H]

BTW that 7'8", shaped by a local shaper who understands the waves around here and what a mid sized board should be to fit into them. It came off the rack, wasn't a custom....rocker and rails, the whole shape of the thing just works here. Give that local shaper who gave you all the free advice some business would be my vote once you've practiced a bit more on the big board. You should be able to get out back as big as you have the guts to ride. Learn to take a step back and weight the tail on the drop, then do it with a little lean and a look down the line while having the thought in your head to raise your front knee up and you're late dropping down a steep face while angling in, keeping the nose up and holding a higher, more gradual drop line so that you are building speed rather than chutes and ladders straight to the bottom and that nose knifing down to the cobbles.....

[TJ1984]

Thnx for the reply. Im 31 years old and buying a used board here is tricky as used boards are scarce and most boards are overpriced and because of my size are much to short for me in this neck of the woods unless they are longboards. I would love to give the shaper my business but he suggested a cheap epoxy because i will most likely give the board a bit of a beating in the learning process. Sorry I didnt explain very well. I can get outside on heavy days if I take the long way and paddle around in a channel or if the waves have a long enough break in between and time it right but sometimes it is tough as the sets are sometimes rapid fire and there is no long way around (mostly when surfing a beach break the waves sometimes stretch across the entire area beach). Alot of times I go out when the conditions are really shitty and hardly anyone is surfing because I know any time in the water is still time in the water. Definitly not the only reason Im thinking to downsize is to get outside I would also like to progress down to a shorter board even if its a challenge at first but I dont want to rush it and go too small too fast because I want to keep catching waves and having fun. Another reason to go shorter is it was suggested to me by a couple local surfers that a shorter board would be a good next step for me but Im definitly not in a rush. I have really enjoyed riding my current board alot though and do sometimes get in early enough on bigger waves but do often nosedive on really steep days. Im still gonna work at it and thanks for the tips. Ive also thought I might just keep riding this board a little longer before stepping down a notch but I would also like a shorter board to have around for when I travel too. As for duckdiving from what ive been told its mostly the tequnique and lots of practice and I may be wrong but a 7'0 doesn't sound impossible in the future, Ive watched a lot of guys pushing the tail down with their feet instesd of their knees but I guess volume and my weight play a big role. Im gonna do a little more searching here and see if I can find a 7'6 or 7'0 with mote volume or something similar that I can try out. When I do order though can anyone advise if a 7'0 pumpkin would float me or is 2 feet way too big of a step down. I used the volume calculator and its suggested i get something around 47 litres and the 7'0 is only 41. Thats cool your in Indonesia I was thinking of trying to get into a surf camp down there for a month to improve more, looks amazing. I have to go pick up my longboard tommorow from a big ding repair so Ill ask again about getting something possibly made for me as Id definitly rather spend my money that way but it makes sense to go for something cheaper at my stage. Would Torq be lumped in with BIC and NSP boards or a bit better quality?
Thanks again

[Big H]

If you are good enough and the waves good enough a 29-30L will work....not a good idea unless you rip though....I would take a 47L over a 41l. It's a world of difference and your longboard most likely is around 75-80L, a lot to get used to. nothing wrong with NSPs either; good float, de not shape and durable as all heck...not that heavy either. If you have decent waves and work at it with the amount of hours you put in that pumpkin seed would work, and you'd be happy because that's what you want right? But don't count on much from the duck dive....yes there are techniques and yes you can get it underwater but once you are in good sized overhead surf it's tough to miss the white cloud and you just don't get deep enough to benefit any more than turning turtle. If it isn't overhead, you can make it outside right down the throat without ducking with a little guile. A 7'6" you can still use toes to pop up but still practice without for when you go shorter. 7'0" you need to be able to pop without toes as shin down will be wet. Don't listen to smaller guys; we are big for surfers and those small boards, most fins, etc are made for 155-175lb guys. I'm 85kg and the same height as you, so just about the same as you; we need bigger boards plain and simple esp as beginners. I would look for a used 7'6" that was 3" thick. It will feel plenty small enough after that longboard, believe me. You can always sell later on, don't stress too much about that, those are popular and resell easy.

[TJ1984]

Cheers man, my gut also tells me a 7'0 might be pushin it. Ive read alot of good reviews about the pumpkin seed I just wish I had the opportunity to demo one first. I think I will wait a bit and maybe look into a 7'6. How was your transition down to a 7'8? Any suggestions for fins for my weight? Unfortunately no fins with this pumpkin (future boxes)

[Big H]

My first transition board from a longboard was a thruster mini mal 7'6"x21.5x2.75"....that transition was rough because I tried to transition down too early in my development (3 months in)...I took it out in head high surf, got sucked over the falls and pitched harder than I have ever been, still to date....managed two big dings, one on each rail where the board hit me in the washing machine....thrown and rolled like 8 times, face dragged on the bottom....etc....anyway, I fixed it and sold it shortly afterward and went back to the longboard which I still had....after two more months I tried a 7'x21x3" big guy shortboard.....wrong again....tried, tried, tried and finally sold it and went back to the longboard....after about 9 months of 30-40h/month of surfing I got a 7'3"x21,5x3" single fin that I was able to ride decently....took three sessions before I could catch waves with it; so different. Kept that for a few months and alternated with the longboard....sold it because it was heavy for its size; probably had water inside. I got some smaller boards and tried them without much luck, went back to the longboard and made a lot of progress...then I got the 7'8". Bottom line, I have and keep going back to the longboard to develop techniques and to break myself out of funks that I get into....recently I kept falling on my face every time when I would pop up...was trying to turn as I popped up on a shorter board....so I went to the longboard and practiced a sesh doing popups and shifting my weight back like in the Wingnut video (19:10 and 20:50 - 21:25 min in the attached video....that smooth push backward/sway to the tail to initiate the turn was what I worked on)....sorted things and I went back to the shorter board and made a breakthrough....seems to be the pattern. I've got the longboard on the bench right now; going to put a fin in then pack it up for tomorrow....small waves tomorrow and want to work on some things....

Check this out; longboard instruction that you can apply to smaller boards as you get them:

[Big H]

I had a similar talk with my local shaper about a year ago...he told me that I should stay on the longboard for the first year or so....now I get it. He also told me to buy used until I sorted out what I liked and wanted rather than guessing at it. Bruce Hansel BTW.....hahahahaha, ironically I just bought one of his boards secondhand....does your shaper do PU boards? Could be a consideration.

[TJ1984]

Thanks man. Sounds like the transition was pretty difficult, glad you got something you like now. I will talk to the shaper again and keep trying to improve on my current board before taking the leap. Did you ever experience rib problems on the longboard? My first few sessions I fractured my ribs. I healed up and changed my paddling technique but when summer came and no neoprene wetsuit between me and the board I then brusied my ribs. I fought through the pain and felt better after a few weeks but the other day was really choppy and the sides of my ribs are in really bad pain now its hard to sleep comfortably. Im really concentrating on my paddling and the way I land on my board when paddling out over waves. Im guessing its because Im a noob and my muscles need to toughen up more. It usually happens if I surf more than 4 days in a row. Was wondering if maybe the bouyancy of the longboard could play a role? Also does Anybody else ride a pumpkin seed? Your impressions?
Thanks

[oldmansurfer]

I have never had sore ribs from paddling a board so not sure what the problem is. Maybe you are damaging your intercostal muscles? I have heard of that injury but not sure why that happens in some individuals.

[Big H]

Existing threads:
https://www.google.com/url?q=http://www ... Ta2WlnKJsQ


https://www.google.com/url?q=http://www ... -hW68zu5-g

I had it when I first started; wore a neoprene vest to keep warm and pad the ribs and that worked out fine. As I developed my back and core muscles, I began to hold myself differently on the board, rather than laying like a sack of potatoes. Once I developed better paddling posture, I never had rib pain again with or without the vest.

[TJ1984]

Thanks. Yea I think it may be muscular also but hoping if I keep surfing itll go away on its own. Intercostal looks nasty though. Ive been doing situps , push ups, pull ups and back extentions every other day so maybe im overdoing it.

[dtc]

Btw, on your board question, both the Torq and the Pupmkin Seed are good choices. The Pumpkin Seed is probably a higher quality board but the Torq is perfectly fine. One benefit (?) of the pumpkin seed is that if you like it and keep surfing, you can just keep buying shorter and shorter versions of it. although that kinda misses out on the fun of trying different boards.

Anyway, I know some good quality surf camps use the Pumpkin Seed. To be honest, at your level (and we have all been there), you probably wont recognise any benefits or limitations, as between the boards, for another couple of years of surfing ie until you get to a higher level, the differences between those two good choices wont be really noticeable. After a couple of years you might find one works for you or doesn't work quite as well or has things that annoy you, but that's down the track and gives you the chance to buy a third board...

[Jester]

I have the torq 7'2 mpd fun and am 6'2/3 myself. It's an absolutely excellent board but I'm not qualified to compare it to much because I haven't tried a lot. It's a massive improvement from the likes of the bics and nsps though. Tough, well shaped, light and nimble. You're coming down from 9' though I wouldn't drop 2' straight away you'd be in for a big shock! 7'6 should suit you nicely. Don't know anything about the pumpkin but the Torq is a winner, Banz has them as well and he swears by them too!

[TJ1984]

Just an update from my last post. I feel like an idiot when I bought my board it was marked as a 9 foot but when I went to the shaper and we were talking about a custom board we measured mine. Its 8 feet 2 inches.... I never bothered to measure it.... Noob mistake. I have a chance to pick up a Firewire addvance 6'8 really cheap. Its in good condition and over 50 litres volume so I know it will float me. Any thoughts on this board? The problem is where Im at nobody does epoxy repairs... is it difficult to do a DIY epoxy repair for small dings and does anyone have experience or thoughts with the addvance?
Thanks

[oldmansurfer]

did you measure it In my opinion even with a lot of volume a shorter board will be more difficult to catch waves with. As far as patching goes it seems somewhat simple.... you can get sun cured epoxy resin patch kit should be ok except for big jobs. Need to make sure you use the right resin. Regular epoxy resin is pretty simple but you have to measure and mix appropriately as in actually measure it and use the carefully measured recommended proportions

[TJ1984]

Oldmansup haha yes Im sure its a 6'8 this time. And Jester thanks for the review of the Torq. Basically I can get a brand new Torq 7'2 fun or a 6'8 Addvance which has been ridden maybe twice for the same price. I know litres isnt everything but I think the Torq fun is 47 litres and the addvance is 53 litres kinda leaning towards the Addvance for the dollar value and more room for progression in the future. What do you guys suggest? And Jester are you able to duckdive your 7'2 torq?

[waikikikichan]

If you have the funds, just buy the 6'8" addvance. It'll be a good board to have as your skills advance ( hence the name )
Is it the right size and can you surf it ? No not yet, but in time yes.
Can you duck dive it ? No not yet and maybe never since it's so much volume. I know I can't.
For repairs, order some ding repair 2 part putty like quickfix or session saver. It doesn't need sun to cure. It is also legal/safe to travel with on airplanes unlike some UV resins in a tube.

[Big H]

Between those two choices I would get the Addvance also. Smaller but has more float, it's progressive like Wchan said and will be good once you get better....and you'll be able to resell it for more $ down the road if you do decide to sell it on and get another board.

I use a 2 part putty on epoxy boards for small dings I don't feel like waiting on at the shop....put it on, wipe it with a wet paper towel about 10 min after applying to smooth it then go over it again once dry with 500grit sandpaper....works perfectly and is very functional; repairs I've done a year ago on boards are still ok....no crumbling, cracking or shrinking. Not the prettiest but then I'm not in it for the fashion.........