Surfing Waves

East coast/Long island surfer here. First summer surfing. Started on an 8ft Costco wavestorm. Then bought a used 7 ft fish with 54 or 55 liters of volume. Feel comfortable on the fish. Looking for something smaller that's more maneuverable but can still float me on smaller days. Like 2-4 foot waves which is most days here except when we get hurricane swells....like right now lol. Was thinking the libtech puddle fish. I'm 5'9 220 lbs now but could probably cut weight to 210 if I needed to. I'm an atheltic bodybuilder type. What is the smallest and largest size I could get away with? I was thinking of just getting the largest they make, the 6'2. Is there even a short board for a 220lb guy? Should I just lose weight? I could definitely drop to 200 lbs at least if I needed to but obviously I don't want to do that unless I absolutely need to

well, if you go by these figures https://surfsimply.com/surf-coaching/vo ... ht-ratios/ and you are a pro surfer, then 33L is a possibility. But reality is that you are probably a surf simply level 3 or level 4 (see the link for explanation), so you are looking at something 45L give or take as being a more reasonable choice.

So a libtech puddle fish 6ft2 would be feasible. Personally I wouldnt recommend it, you can get a nice fat 6'6 board (eg firewire greedy beaver or an egg shape or something like the hayden shapes 'plunder' at 6'8). Those boards will all be much easier to surf than the libtech, unless you are a better surfer than most first year surfers (eg even the libtech blurb says it requires rail to rail surfing - are you doing that?)

Keep in mind that my suggestions are to encourage a slightly easier transition. If you want a puddle fish then go for it; if it turns out to be above your skill level you can always surf your current board and nothing is lost - eventually you will get to the puddle fish. But slow and easy is better; shorter boards require very different skills to a 7ft board.

Wonderbrah wrote:Looking for something smaller that's more maneuverable

1) What's not so maneuverable about it ?
2) Have you tried swapping out for different fins ?

waikikikichan wrote:

Wonderbrah wrote:Looking for something smaller that's more maneuverable

1) What's not so maneuverable about it ?
2) Have you tried swapping out for different fins ?

It's probably my lack of skill but it seems hard to transition rail to rail. I can do a bottom turn but can't do a top turn. the dims are 7'0", 23", 3", and 52 L of volume actually. I haven't tried swapping fins, no. I'm just using the fins that came with it, some kind of future fin in a quad setup.

dtc wrote:well, if you go by these figures https://surfsimply.com/surf-coaching/vo ... ht-ratios/ and you are a pro surfer, then 33L is a possibility. But reality is that you are probably a surf simply level 3 or level 4 (see the link for explanation), so you are looking at something 45L give or take as being a more reasonable choice.

So a libtech puddle fish 6ft2 would be feasible. Personally I wouldnt recommend it, you can get a nice fat 6'6 board (eg firewire greedy beaver or an egg shape or something like the hayden shapes 'plunder' at 6'8). Those boards will all be much easier to surf than the libtech, unless you are a better surfer than most first year surfers (eg even the libtech blurb says it requires rail to rail surfing - are you doing that?)

Keep in mind that my suggestions are to encourage a slightly easier transition. If you want a puddle fish then go for it; if it turns out to be above your skill level you can always surf your current board and nothing is lost - eventually you will get to the puddle fish. But slow and easy is better; shorter boards require very different skills to a 7ft board.

What about that same 6'6 size but something like the firewire dominator or Lost v3 Rocket? Would a hybrid/high volume shortboard be a bad idea?

Wonderbrah wrote:It's probably my lack of skill but it seems hard to transition rail to rail. I can do a bottom turn but can't do a top turn. the dims are 7'0", 23", 3", and 52 L of volume actually.

If you can do a good bottom turn but have a hard time doing top turns :
1) You are transitioning too late, start the roll from inside rail MID-FACE. By the time you reach the top ( when you brain sends the info to your legs ), it's too late.
2) Your body is still "closed". You need to look at the landing, open your chest to the beach, lead with the front hand, etc. You still maybe be pointed up when you wanted to go down.
3) Your stance may be too strong. If your front toes are point to the 3 o'clock ( regular footer going right ), when you try to turn left, the body ergonomics resist the turn. Better to point between 1-2 o'clock.

4) My board is 9'0" , 22.1" , 2.7" 63 L I am 125 lbs. 5'2" tall. You CAN turn that 7'0".

Wonderbrah wrote: I haven't tried swapping fins, no. I'm just using the fins that came with it, some kind of future fin in a quad setup.

If you do know how to turn properly, I would set it up as a THRUSTER 3 fin until you get positioning, timing and placement on the wave down. I would never recommend QUADS for learning to turn. Does your board have a 5 fins set up or is ti strictly quad ?

Going to a shorter board will make things harder as you will have take off later, in the steeper part of the wave, glide will be lessened so you will need to create speed more by pumping, things will happen quicker and as your reaction times.

If you are still working on your bottom and top turns then don't get a smaller board, that will make it harder to learn. Stick with your board or the Wavestorm until you figure out your top and bottom turn and how to generate speed. I have an easier time turning and generating speed on my 9' longboards (noserider single fin and 2+1 performance longboard) than I do my 6'4" quad fish. A longer board gives you more opportunities, time, and margin of error to practice turns. When surfing my quad fish I barely have enough time to pop-up and do a bottom turn before the wave breaks since I have to catch the wave when it is more critical and close to breaking. When the surf is decent, I typically catch 10-15 waves per hour on a longboard vs 3-5 waves on the fish, since I catch the waves earlier on my long board and can still surf the flatter sections, my rides are 2-5x longer. For me, this works out to getting to riding the wave 10x more on longboard than a fish per session.

waikikikichan wrote:

Wonderbrah wrote:It's probably my lack of skill but it seems hard to transition rail to rail. I can do a bottom turn but can't do a top turn. the dims are 7'0", 23", 3", and 52 L of volume actually.

If you can do a good bottom turn but have a hard time doing top turns :
1) You are transitioning too late, start the roll from inside rail MID-FACE. By the time you reach the top ( when you brain sends the info to your legs ), it's too late.
2) Your body is still "closed". You need to look at the landing, open your chest to the beach, lead with the front hand, etc. You still maybe be pointed up when you wanted to go down.
3) Your stance may be too strong. If your front toes are point to the 3 o'clock ( regular footer going right ), when you try to turn left, the body ergonomics resist the turn. Better to point between 1-2 o'clock.

4) My board is 9'0" , 22.1" , 2.7" 63 L I am 125 lbs. 5'2" tall. You CAN turn that 7'0".

Wonderbrah wrote: I haven't tried swapping fins, no. I'm just using the fins that came with it, some kind of future fin in a quad setup.

If you do know how to turn properly, I would set it up as a THRUSTER 3 fin until you get positioning, timing and placement on the wave down. I would never recommend QUADS for learning to turn. Does your board have a 5 fins set up or is ti strictly quad ?

Going to a shorter board will make things harder as you will have take off later, in the steeper part of the wave, glide will be lessened so you will need to create speed more by pumping, things will happen quicker and as your reaction times.

Thanks, yeah I think I need to work on getting the basics of turning down before I get a shorter board. No, It just allows for either quad or twin keel setup. Here's the link to the board

http://www.naturesshapes.com/b7.php

Do you think it's critical to be on a thruster setup for learning turns?

Okay so coming back to reality and realizing my low skill level, I think I want to get a real longboard or maybe a funboard? The waves aren't great often on the east coast so I need an easy, floaty wave catching machine but also one that is good for learning turns with the goal in mind of eventually sizing down and being able to "rip" in the future. I was thinking of either getting a longboard (poly or epoxy?) shaped from a local guy or maybe getting the Lost Crowd Killer which reading the description seems fitting.Sorry for being so indecisive. I'm not really sure what I want. I just know that I want to be eventually be able to rip and ride those small, high nose rockered boards like all those shortboarders I see. What's a good board for leading me on that journey?

Wonderbrah wrote: I need an easy, floaty wave catching machine but also one that is good for learning turns with the goal in mind of eventually sizing down and being able to "rip" in the future. I was thinking of either getting a longboard (poly or epoxy?) shaped from a local guy or maybe getting the Lost Crowd Killer which reading the description seems fitting.

If you're planning to get a Lost crowd killer, what's the difference in the current 7'0" Fish you already own ?

If you're planning to get a custom shape from a local shopper, don't talk to us, sit down with him and have a nice discussion. You need to be totally honest about your skill level and wants/desires.
( why would you want to go EPS/Epoxy instead of PU/PE on your first custom ? )

You probably arent going to get an 'easier' board around 7ft/lost crowd killer volume to progress on than the one you have ie you could get an egg shape which is an easier more fun board to surf (and may suit your conditions better), but your fish is closer to your ultimate aim of a short board.

The only material benefit in swapping is getting a thruster rather than a quad. But I suspect you have a technique 'issue' (ie learning to do); a new board wont solve that. This is not a criticism, learning to turn is a big hurdle for all surfers and takes a while and a bit of dedication and some research into what exactly you are meant to do and not do.

Since you seem so keen on buying a new board, Lost Crowd Killer or CI Water Hog in 7'6 to 8' range might be a good one. Thruster is probably a better set up than quad for learning, and it'll be good to have a mid- length to a long board in a quiver anyway. Once the length goes below 7'6 or so, it seems to become a lot harder to paddle and less stable. Epoxy might be good if you are worried about the dings... even then they aren't ding-proof either.

BTW, you can start with a proper long board and still eventually be able to rip on a short board. Just go down in size a little at a time as your skill level goes up. There is no particular benefit to starting short from the beginning.

One more... if you are having trouble with the frontside top turn, it'll probably help to practice riding backside in general and then work on backside bottom turns.

In my opinion....people fuss over volume but instead should look at surface area instead. (Width)
My current weight is 220 lbs and I am 56 years old. I recently got myself a 6’2 x 24” wide fish. I need the extra surface area to get in earlier because my reflexes are slowing down. Of course I have been surfing for over 40 years and always had shortboards. So, go wider for stability, and gradually go down in size.
Steve

Nice board. I am around your weight however I should be about 20 to 30 pounds lighter which it seems you don't carry that extra weight. That would however be a good design for an older heavy guy. I would call that a swallow tail sting. But it's a good design for old guys because it has a lot of planing area and the swallow makes it like it has 2 smaller tails and the sting makes the tail narrower for more critical waves but leaves the maximum volume in front where you need it for paddling.

I should say that isn't a beginners board

The illustration on that board looks like part of the Strangers In The Night album by UFO!

That is correct! UFO is my all time favorite band.
“Rock Bottom! You got it.”

Yup, Rock Bottom, Michael Schenker...THAT solo!

HyeSurfer wrote:In my opinion....people fuss over volume but instead should look at surface area instead. (Width)
My current weight is 220 lbs and I am 56 years old. I recently got myself a 6’2 x 24” wide fish. I need the extra surface area to get in earlier because my reflexes are slowing down. Of course I have been surfing for over 40 years and always had shortboards. So, go wider for stability, and gradually go down in size.
Steve

I was about to state exactly this. When I weighed 205lbs my go to board was a 6'6 fish, much like the picture HyeSurfer posted. I also had a 6'10 as my small/mushy wave board. I'm down to 175, so I have a 6'2 retro fish and 6'6 simmons, but yes wide and thick is the key to us more prone to gravity...