Transition to Fish

[jkkrs310]

I started surfing about 5 years ago and I'm 50 years old and in good physical shape. I started with a 9 foot long board and then transitioned to a 8 foot mid board then to a 7'-2" hybrid. I'm currently trying to ride a 5'-9" x 21 x 2.6 fish with a quad set up.

I knew this jump down to the fish wasn't going to be easy. My shaper told me that some of the challenges that I'll need to overcome was paddling endurance and getting into the wave. Well he was right on. Paddling the smaller board is really tough I'm getting better each time I go out. Also learning how to start paddling for a wave really early or waiting later hasn't been easy either and has been a eye opener compared to surfing a long board. I've been riding this board since Jan and most days I'm only catching a couple wave......on bad days I'm catching none.

One of my problems ever since I went down to the smaller board is worrying about the pop up. I'm so concerned about popping up and foot position that I now have a bad habit of looking down which as you know leads to falling off.

On slightly bigger waves (~5 feet) this issue isn't as bad since everything is moving so much faster I don't have time to look down and everything is fine and I catch the wave.

Do you guys have any tips to break this habit. I know you need to have chin up and look down the line. when do you guys start looking down the line? is it when your paddling for the wave? is it when you in the wave?

Seems very basic and no different when riding my longer boards but im kinda messed up right now.

Thanks in advance.

[oldmansurfer]

From 7'2" to 5'9" is a huge jump down in size. It kind of sounds like maybe you got a board that is too short for you. Or maybe you need to get a transition board in between 7'2" and 5'9". Are you surfing alone? Sometimes having someone else to look at where you are lining up will help. Otherwise I would think this, go back to whitewater takeoffs and just ride the wave laying down but try to angle over to the green face of the wave and if you get there then try to pop up. Work on your paddling and wave reading. With a shorter board you need to lineup closer to the peak or right at it and instead of outside you need to be right where it is breaking. For paddling you need to be paddling regularly like at least once a week but more would be better. If you are going out in crowded lineups also that doesn't mean you are getting any practice paddling as much of your time is likely spent waiting. So the question is why did you get a 5'9" board?

[dtc]

My shaper told me that some of the challenges that I'll need to overcome was paddling endurance and getting into the wave. Well he was right on. Paddling the smaller board is really tough I'm getting better each time I go out. Also learning how to start paddling for a wave really early or waiting later hasn't been easy either and has been a eye opener compared to surfing a long board. I've been riding this board since Jan and most days I'm only catching a couple wave......on bad days I'm catching none.

One of my problems ever since I went down to the smaller board is worrying about the pop up. I'm so concerned about popping up and foot position that I now have a bad habit of looking down which as you know leads to falling off..

Well, you know your problems and I think (for what that's worth) you are correctly analysing your problems. So you know how to fix them as well (easier said than done) - but its paddle fitness, paddle power and positioning. Just practice and determination.

As to the pop up, its 'the yips' as golfers say. There is no reason why popping up on a smaller or slower wave is any different to a big wave, you just have convinced yourself its an issue and, therefore, its an issue. Sports psychologist 101 lesson! All you can do is either (a) visualise and convince yourself you will do it or (b) ignore the voices in your head and just do it and prove the fear is wrong. But if you want to look up fixing the yips or something like that, I'm sure there are some good suggestions on the internet.

Or the 'sensible' suggestion, if you still have your longer board - go and surf that for 5 sessions, nail the pop up, convince yourself you can pop up and then go back to the other board. After a pile of sessions without catching many waves, its probably useful refresher as well.

[Big H]

One of my problems ever since I went down to the smaller board is worrying about the pop up. I'm so concerned about popping up and foot position that I now have a bad habit of looking down which as you know leads to falling off.

On slightly bigger waves (~5 feet) this issue isn't as bad since everything is moving so much faster I don't have time to look down and everything is fine and I catch the wave.

Do you guys have any tips to break this habit. I know you need to have chin up and look down the line. when do you guys start looking down the line? is it when your paddling for the wave? is it when you in the wave?

Tips? Go back to your bigger board.

I don't think you have the yips.....I think the board is way too small for you at this point or ever.....pop ups on a 7'2" for me at 185cm I can still use my feet to push off....at 5'9" there is no cheating and you have to pop up clean from your knees and stick your feet perfectly as there is no room for missing that either as you'll bog the board out if you're not pretty close to spot on at that length. No way to crawl up either; has to be a clean and fast pop, smooth enough not to put the brakes on before you even start.

Question: Why do you want to try to ride a board so small? If it is to rip waves, you found out the answer if you only can catch two or less a session.

Fish boards are funny too....there is very little rocker which means steep late takeoffs are out, which means you need to get into the wave relatively early....that also means that fish boards are relatively limited....you don't see too many around here for instance since waves are steeper than fat for the most part and a flat rockered fish hates a jacking hollow wave......

Using a shorter board you need spot on positioning and a good paddle....there is no padding early with a 5'9"; short boards you have to be pretty much on the spot that you are going to catch, three or five strokes and that's it....if you're paddling more than that you're out of position....you aren't going to get that speed up like on a longer board with extra paddles. Longer boards are forgiving; forgiveness in this case means your take off zone is broader and paddling is easier and the top end is faster....so you can paddle early, get up to "speed" and cruise waiting for the wave to catch you.....short board you need to pick your spot and go take the wave.

If you can't pop up while looking down the wave in both directions from before you even start to paddle, you need to learn to do that and do it fairly well on the bigger board before going small......as you have found out it gets a lot more critical and learning that skill along with doing everything faster and more precisely than you have been will like being starting from scratch. Rinky put up a video of Kelly Slater taking off the other day.....here it is, watch his eyes and his head as he goes for the wave.....you're checking the wave as it approaches, take a look down the line, check forward and then on the wave again.....he's in a contest situation....for us mortals add in snakers and potential drop ins as well as anyone deeper than you going for the same wave....you HAVE to be able to do this so that you can pull off at the last second if they take the wave....

If you really want to go down in size I'd say that your next board after a 7'2" should be around the 6'6" - 6'8" range. That will be plenty to bite off and keep you busy for awhile.

As far as breaking the habit, practice at home doing pop ups in the living room with spots marked out for your feet so that you can hit the spots consistently while staring at a ceiling corner in the process....practice frontside and backside corners ......chin up, chest up, stand up....other thing that helps is to practice better posture....sittiing in a chair try to squeeze your shoulder blades together....look over each shoulder.....now relax and look over each shoulder - it's harder right? Try to maintain a better posture while paddling (shoulders back but not tense) and you'll be able to look around with less strain and pop ups seem to flow easier as well with shoulders back and chin up.

[Big H]

If there is one thing that I'm learning buy trying different boards at all kinds of lengths and volumes it is that in the end you're still surfing and no matter what is under your feet, you have to be able to read, find, catch and ride the wave.....fundamentals like angled takeoffs, bottom turns, pop ups, how to get out back should be learned on a board that is easier than harder because in the end those fundamentals are the same for all boards, so why not practice on something that makes learning the techniques easier and faster then translating that learned skill to a shorter board which generally means same just quicker, more precise and exacting, but if you know how to do that given skill on a longboard (pop up without looking down for instance) you'll be a lot closer to being able to do that skill on a shorter board than if you kinda gloss over those fundamentals on the way to rushing for a board that you can duck dive.

My 2 cents......

[oldmansurfer]

I am not sure about this one. I think popups are different on longboards and shortboards. If you learn on a longboard it doesn't mean you can do it on a shortboard but if you learn on a shortboard you can popup on a longboard. Popping up on a longboard is easy, you have lots of time and it provides a real stable base to work on and there is a larger area of the board that you can be ok popping up on. It doesn't translate to shortboard skills plus the lineup is also different. In my opinion at some point you just have to learn to use a shortboard but I like the scaling down method, just getting used to boards about 6 inches shorter. Then you can gradually change popups as you go down. Then you can also acquire a huge quiver of boards all 6 inches length difference.

[jkkrs310]

Thank you for all of your input. I'll try and respond to some of your question.

As for why the 5' 9" board. My shaper thought with the increased volume of the fish I would be able to manage. As I mentioned earlier he did say that it would be challenging for all of the reasons we stated below. Believe me it's not a pride thing but until you actual try it you really don't realize what a big difference it is when surfing a shorter board. Now I totally understand the differences between surfing a longer board vs. and shorter board and for that it's not a total loss. Now that I think of it I probably should've tried a couple shorter boards out first before buying one.

I do surf with friends who give me tips but thought I would ask the forum.

As you mentioned below I know now that my next board should've been in the mid 6 foot range. While it is extremely frustrating I plan to stay with it and know it will take a lot of time.

Again I appreciate all of the input and will incorporate your suggestions.

Thank you.

[drowningbitbybit]

I sometimes surf a stubby 5'10. It's not, to be honest, my favourite board but I do like the blend of shortness and volume (...if only I could get rid of the width and the thickness, but that wouldn't work) so I know where you're coming from.

One thing that I find is that - with me on it - it absolutely doesn't work on waves with any kind of pitch on them. It's great on weak crumbling waves that are bordering on wind swell, but forget it on proper groundswell (even when small) unless there's an onshore breeze knocking the top off it.

On a crumbly slope it's actually very easy to pop up on - very stable and plenty of time. So for this type of board, it's all about what wave you're on.

Definitely not my go-to everyday board.

So my advice would be to add it to the quiver, wait until the right day... but in the meantime have something a touch longer and more forgiving

[oldmansurfer]

Great jkkrs310! Keep us updated on your progress. Also curious what is your height and weight? Also I forgot to mention the obvious solution to go for waves over 5 ft.

[jkkrs310]

Also curious what is your height and weight?

I'm 5' 6" and 153 lbs.

Thanks!